Angband 4.0beta status

[Nick]

Post 4.0 we probably need to have a big hashing out of how all the different aspects of level design are going to work and try to make it all work as one unified system. (I'd tentatively suggest separating room layouts out into three edit files, one for standard rooms, one for vaults/treasure-containing rooms, one for pits/monster-containing rooms - ideally all using the exact same format - in combination with another edit file containing monster/object themes that could be applied to any or all as suits the level type.)

My plans for traps are going to have an impact here too. I will post my more detailed 4.1-4.3 plans a bit later.

PS: Those screenshots look wonderful.

[Nomad]

If you look at the current vaults file, you'll see that there's a section about halfway down called "Interesting Rooms" containing a lot of small interesting shaped (unsurprisingly) rooms, and below that more vaults. These don't appear currently, but after the 4.0 release I'll be wanting to bring them in. So feel free to look through that for ideas. Rethinking the relationship between vaults and template rooms and how they appear is on the table, too.

Yes, I've had a poke through those! I have lots of thoughts on combining special rooms with 'monster profiles' like pit profiles, so you can use the same room multiple ways (fill the designated monster spots with priests and it's an abbey, fill them with warriors instead and it's a barracks, etc.), giving you a dramatically larger pool of possible different rooms from a small number of layouts. And that would also facilitate themed levels - fill every room on the level out according to the same profile, and you've got an orc town or a level full of fire monsters. Plus I think you could merge pits into the same concept - I definitely think pit layouts should be moved out to an edit file at some point so we can have round and irregular pits and use different types of layouts for pit vs. nest.

There's also the type/rating lines in room_template.txt, which don't do anything yet but can be used to control the sort of rooms that appear - in the rooms I'm currently designing I've been grouping them into four types (rectangular, round, other standard geometric shapes, and irregular rooms) which you could use to create level profiles where all the rooms on the level are round or they're all unusual shapes with no standard rectangles, etc. Whereas the rating value I'm thinking of as a way to have more control over the size and treasure-level of rooms generated, so you could specify levels with all small/large rooms, make rooms with guaranteed treasures more likely to appear at deeper depths, etc.

Post 4.0 we probably need to have a big hashing out of how all the different aspects of level design are going to work and try to make it all work as one unified system. (I'd tentatively suggest separating room layouts out into three edit files, one for standard rooms, one for vaults/treasure-containing rooms, one for pits/monster-containing rooms - ideally all using the exact same format - in combination with another edit file containing monster/object themes that could be applied to any or all as suits the level type.)

[Nick]

Okay, I've finally got around to updating my tileset for 4.0! Really just a few minor additions/tweaks:

- new lava and passable rubble tiles
- new tiles for the reintroduced food types (whiskey/wine/biscuits)
- finally updated the Angel tiles to Ainur (meaning Blue Wizards are actually blue!)
- made the numbers on priest books more readable because that always bugged me
- added a few generic terrains and tiles for trapped doors/staircases for possible future use

I can't remember how to get into my ancient Git account, so Nick, if you could upload the attached updated versions of 8x16.png and graf-nmd.prf, that would be great.

This is awesome - thank you.

(Incidentally, I know this is a no-gameplay-changes update, but since it doesn't affect much would you like some more special room designs for room_template.txt? I've got about 50 designs I've been working on and am aiming to try and finish a hundred to double the current number of rooms.)

I'll actually say no for 4.0, but a big yes for 4.1. If you look at the current vaults file, you'll see that there's a section about halfway down called "Interesting Rooms" containing a lot of small interesting shaped (unsurprisingly) rooms, and below that more vaults. These don't appear currently, but after the 4.0 release I'll be wanting to bring them in. So feel free to look through that for ideas. Rethinking the relationship between vaults and template rooms and how they appear is on the table, too.

[Nomad]

Okay, I've finally got around to updating my tileset for 4.0! Really just a few minor additions/tweaks:

- new lava and passable rubble tiles
- new tiles for the reintroduced food types (whiskey/wine/biscuits)
- finally updated the Angel tiles to Ainur (meaning Blue Wizards are actually blue!)
- made the numbers on priest books more readable because that always bugged me
- added a few generic terrains and tiles for trapped doors/staircases for possible future use

I can't remember how to get into my ancient Git account, so Nick, if you could upload the attached updated versions of 8x16.png and graf-nmd.prf, that would be great.

(Incidentally, I know this is a no-gameplay-changes update, but since it doesn't affect much would you like some more special room designs for room_template.txt? I've got about 50 designs I've been working on and am aiming to try and finish a hundred to double the current number of rooms.)

[Nick]

Disarming works right in today's build, but the run bug is still there. Not related.

Cool - and I have a fix for the run bug which will be in the next update.

[pen]

Disarming works right in today's build, but the run bug is still there. Not related.

[Nick]

in http://angband.oook.cz/ladder-show.php?id=17774 there is no entry in the player history about finding Amras.

Wow, well found! I have no clue about this one. Anyone else notice it? PowerWyrm - any idea of anything that might be relevant?

[Thraalbee]

in http://angband.oook.cz/ladder-show.php?id=17774 there is no entry in the player history about finding Amras.

[pen]

Excellent! Running past items is a known bug - I had been unable to repeat it reliably until now, but this explains when it's happening.

I'm not sure, but I noticed that trap disarming doesn't appear to be auto as well, you actually have to hit the disarm key combo and pick a direction. It feels like may be related. I have no idea why.

[Nomad]

My first attempt at this gives a message if the taken off item goes to a different slot, so other stuff moves too, but not if it's a straight swap. This is different to 3.5.1, but might this actually be an improvement?

I don't think the message is necessary - I feel like it should only occur for 'unexpected' movement within the pack, i.e. not directly initiated by the player. If I'm actively shuffling my own equipment around, I anticipate that things will rearrange according; if I'm only identifying an item, I don't necessarily expect that it's going to hop into a new slot by itself after the name change, so that's when you need the message to alert you that it's happened.

[Nick]

Movement bug - latest build, roguelike command set. When using 'Run' (Shift-Direction) one stops next to an item, presumably so you don't actually pick it up by accident if you have auto-pickup configured. I do not use auto-pickup.

So, typically I would shift-run again and stop directly on top of the item, and press my key to pick it up if I've decided I would like to. However, in the latest builds doing so leads the character to run OVER the item stopping on the opposite side of it, necessitating a backtrack to pick it up.

Excellent! Running past items is a known bug - I had been unable to repeat it reliably until now, but this explains when it's happening.

[Nick]

I have seen traps hide a downstair a few times. Not sure if that is a bug or not but don't recall seeing that in v3.

Yeah, that's a known bug - I just haven't been able to work out what's causing it yet.

[Thraalbee]

I have seen traps hide a downstair a few times. Not sure if that is a bug or not but don't recall seeing that in v3.

[pen]

Movement bug - latest build, roguelike command set. When using 'Run' (Shift-Direction) one stops next to an item, presumably so you don't actually pick it up by accident if you have auto-pickup configured. I do not use auto-pickup.

So, typically I would shift-run again and stop directly on top of the item, and press my key to pick it up if I've decided I would like to. However, in the latest builds doing so leads the character to run OVER the item stopping on the opposite side of it, necessitating a backtrack to pick it up.

It's really hard to play this way. Can that be fixed perhaps? Thank you for your work Nick!

[Nick]

This is almost working perfectly now! Just one case I've found where you still get an unnecessary message: if you use the wield command to swap an item in for one that's already equipped. Wielding to an empty slot is fine (and hence if you use t to take off the existing item and then wield the new one you don't get any messages) but I assume swapping is satisfying the "nothing added or removed" condition and accidentally triggering the message.

My first attempt at this gives a message if the taken off item goes to a different slot, so other stuff moves too, but not if it's a straight swap. This is different to 3.5.1, but might this actually be an improvement?