Angband 3.1.1 released

[takkaria]

I've always wondered about that, actually. I guess oil spontaneously bursts into flame upon impact in the Angband world. I suppose it could be argued that you use your light source to light it first, but what if you're using the Arkenstone, Phial or Star?

Torches and lanterns also seem to spontaneously conflagrate when you "equip" them (how do characters hold their torches when they're also wielding a weapon and shield?).

We could get into the oddities of the dungeon ecosystem as well, but this is all for another thread. Gotta love this crazy Angbandian world of ours.

What hero would be a hero without tinder and flint? Honestly. As if they just "lit up". And flasks of oil have a mechanism to strike a match when they shatter. Just so you know. *

* this may not apply in variants

[ehertlein]

So I found a Ring of Escaping (+4) earlier and sold it because I was worried about the "Makes casting spells more difficult" in the description. Then I found another and thought I would ask what exactly were the effects, but this one I found... It doesn't show the speed bonus and it won't let me ID it.

I think that may be a 3.1.1 bug.

(edit)
Oddly enough, if I inspect it, it says +4 speed.

[Magnate]

Oil has gone nuclear. I killed a novice warrior throwing a single flask in 1591. I guess it is 3 * (2d6) damage, more than a +9 shortbow. Is it really meant to be this powerful?

I rather like this. How many times do you decide to carry a stack of oil flasks instead of using that slot for arrows? Never. Now there's a possible reason to do so, at least in the early game. Sure it does a lot of damage compared with unenchanted bows - but you go through oil four times as fast (100% break compared with 25%).

Finally it means that early encounters with Grip, Fang and Bullroarer are not necessarily instadeaths.

[PowerDiver]

I rather like this. How many times do you decide to carry a stack of oil flasks instead of using that slot for arrows? Never.

My current *standard* kit is to take 3 flasks of oil for throwing. That's when they do only 2d6. Now it feels like cheating.

This 21 avg damage oil is way too unbalancing unless you make oil only available in the dungeon.

[pampl]

So I found a Ring of Escaping (+4) earlier and sold it because I was worried about the "Makes casting spells more difficult" in the description. Then I found another and thought I would ask what exactly were the effects, but this one I found... It doesn't show the speed bonus and it won't let me ID it.

I think that may be a 3.1.1 bug.

(edit)
Oddly enough, if I inspect it, it says +4 speed.

Rings of TP are the same way. The pval is fixed so there's no need to identify, but because you can't identify the pval won't show up.

[saarn]

stores toned down?

in 3.1.0 I'd frequently see armors of elvenkind/dwarvenkind, weapons of westerness, defenders, etc. by about the time my character hit dlvl 35. Recently played to dlvl 50 without seeing anything better than some weapons of slay undead and some gloves of free action.

Not that this is necessarily bad, but it changes the game dynamic (money is only useful for staples and whatever is in the black market, vs saving up in case an elvenkind appears in the armor shop).

Also noticed something strange in the pricing code-- in the weapons shop, I saw bolts of venom (+5,+3) for nearly the same price as bolts (+5,+5)-- surely the bolts of venom should be at least three times the cost?

[Pete Mack]

in 3.1.0 I'd frequently see armors of elvenkind/dwarvenkind, weapons of westerness, defenders, etc. by about the time my character hit dlvl 35. Recently played to dlvl 50 without seeing anything better than some weapons of slay undead and some gloves of free action.

That's just bad luck. The code is unchanged.

    /*
     * Decide min/max levels
     */
    if (st == STORE_B_MARKET)
    {
        min_level = p_ptr->max_depth + 5;
        max_level = p_ptr->max_depth + 20;
    }
    else
    {
        min_level = 1 + MAX(p_ptr->max_depth - 10, 0);
        max_level = STORE_OBJ_LEVEL + MAX(p_ptr->max_depth - 10, 0);
    }

    if (min_level > 55) min_level = 55;
    if (max_level > 70) max_level = 70;

Also noticed something strange in the pricing code-- in the weapons shop, I saw bolts of venom (+5,+3) for nearly the same price as bolts (+5,+5)-- surely the bolts of venom should be at least three times the cost?

That's a bug.

[Magnate]

That's a bug.

Possibly, but I suspect not.

Bolt (+5, +5) should do dam (3+5)x3.5 = 28 which means power 56+5 = 61

Bolt of Venom (+5, +3) should do dam (3+3)x3.5x1.5 = 31.5 which means power 63+5 = 68

So they ought to be priced within about 10% of each other. Venom is a weak brand, and +dam on bolts makes a big difference.

[Pete Mack]

Possibly, but I suspect not.

Bolt (+5, +5) should do dam (3+5)x3.5 = 28 which means power 56+5 = 61

Bolt of Venom (+5, +3) should do dam (3+3)x3.5x1.5 = 31.5 which means power 63+5 = 68

So they ought to be priced within about 10% of each other. Venom is a weak brand, and +dam on bolts makes a big difference.

The relative pricing on ego bolts should assume a launcher bonus of +7 or more. Bolts of venom (even when you start at +3) can potentially destroy Smaug with an ordinary Lt Xbow at:

(3+5+9)*3*3 = 153 damage/shot.

Ordinary bolts do ony 51 damage/shot. It's a huge difference.

I certainly would enchant branded bolts to +5 before using them. In the early game, I consider them to be artifact quality, and use them very carefully. (The actual brand is immaterial; you can always find a few worthy targets.)

[PowerDiver]

Possibly, but I suspect not.

Bolt (+5, +5) should do dam (3+5)x3.5 = 28 which means power 56+5 = 61

Bolt of Venom (+5, +3) should do dam (3+3)x3.5x1.5 = 31.5 which means power 63+5 = 68

So they ought to be priced within about 10% of each other. Venom is a weak brand, and +dam on bolts makes a big difference.

That is completely insane.

You should assume the player enchants the ammo up to +7 or more and has an x3 launcher +15 or so. The venom brand is worth roughly an additional 150 points of damage, or equivalent to an additional +50 damage on the ammo. And that is a conservative estimate. If you say venom is least useful brand, I retort that value is superlinear in damage, which makes up for it.

[edit] I mean venom brand = 50 * value of +1, not that venom brand = +50

Chars with wimpy bows shouldn't even be allowed to look at branded ammo in the shops. It should be stored in the VIP-only room. Maybe we should be assuming an x4 +20 launcher, which would make a brand equiv to +60 on the ammo.

[saarn]

wait, venom is only a 1.5x brand? Wish there was a nice way in game to represent that-- I assumed all the elemental brands were x3

Even so, that's basically upgrading your launcher to a weapon of might, easily worth 20 damage right there.

Edit:

Why does Eddie's VIP room for ammo remind me of Chris Rock's take on gun control?

[ekolis]

Sorry if this has been reported already, but from the start of the game my self-knowledge screen tells me that my weapon is fire-branded or burns my foes or something... presumably that comes from wielding a torch? Do torches actually apply fire brand to barehanded melee attacks? They don't seem to apply it to attacks with an actual weapon - which is the behavior I'd expect, but I'd not expect the self-knowledge message to appear unless I'm actually fighting with no melee weapon save for the torch!

[PowerDiver]

wait, venom is only a 1.5x brand?

I think venom is still x3, which means its value is additional x2. Maybe he is accounting for the likelihood a monster is vulnerable to poison.

In any case, when I used to play NPP I was more than happy to pay on the order of 1K per ammo for the store service to brand ammo. At that price it was unbalancing. Money is a bit scarcer in V, so I'm not sure whether 1K per branded ammo is too cheap.

[JohnCW9]

Sorry if this has been reported already, but from the start of the game my self-knowledge screen tells me that my weapon is fire-branded or burns my foes or something... presumably that comes from wielding a torch? Do torches actually apply fire brand to barehanded melee attacks? They don't seem to apply it to attacks with an actual weapon - which is the behavior I'd expect, but I'd not expect the self-knowledge message to appear unless I'm actually fighting with no melee weapon save for the torch!

I seen the same thing with a high-elf priest.

John

[ekolis]

Ooh, I found another bug... somehow when I press "h" on the Character screen with this one particular savegame, the game crashes... it didn't used to crash with that savegame though; all I did was start a new character (dwarven priest) and enter the dungeon!

Where should I send the savegame?