Sil screencasting / let's play

[HallucinationMushroom]

I'm a little thick, but, does that mean you would sort of be like an announcer? If so, I request a pirate persona. If I get a chance I will try to record some playing, though I don't consider myself a good player. I just like to butcher stuff with easy race/class combos.

[debo]

lol yup that's pretty much it, just like a sportscaster except way nerdier

[WildKhaine]

That's a pretty neat idea. debo the Silcaster.

[debo]

Next video up: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zoYES7spmgw

[HugoVirtuoso]

Next video up: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zoYES7spmgw

If you can, make a video with the two Rings of Accuracy (+2) Smithing start...because this will have interesting starting outcomes. (Well, one of my outcomes from this eventually killed Morgoth and won!)

Someday, you should make a video of yourself (or anyone) taking Morgoth down and winning the game in style.

[debo]

New series! This time around, I'm casting a Edain Hador character played by clouded, who was nice enough to give me termcasts of his game!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4FzfIEPUpAY

[clouded]

A couple comments: The reason I went with power is because I was fairly sure I wanted to go heavy weapons, combined with the knowledge that, well, if I wanted to go to the finesse tree I have melee affinity so it's not a big deal (can always turn power off if need be). Power is also more reliable than finesse, especially with a lower than normal dex (and having 3 str).

I'm not sure why I left that mail of protection the ground, I do remember thinking about it and making some sort of judgement call on it, but not exactly why. Probably it's because I had found that [-2,1d7] studded leather and I have a habit of eschewing things with penalties early on, but it still would have made sense to carry it. Despite what it might have seemed before then, my thought generally is to have as little penalty as possible early (which I think you go with too). I'm not really sure why I didn't wear a shield though! Especially that [+0,1d4] round shield.

The time where I deliberated whether to get charge, I checked my weapon weights and (I assume) wouldn't be getting full sides, so I didn't want to commit to it. I spend a lot of time agonising over what abilities to get, honestly I don't even remember what I ended up with.

I didn't pick up that throwing axe because it wouldn't stack, the only time I will carry one that won't stack is if it's an unidentified ego item (then I'll likely drop it after I ID it).

[half]

I didn't pick up that throwing axe because it wouldn't stack, the only time I will carry one that won't stack is if it's an unidentified ego item (then I'll likely drop it after I ID it).

This is what I do too.

Do people have a suggestion for how to improve this in Sil? With arrows, I made it such that there are only four types to help with stacking woes. I'm hesitant to mess with throwing weapons too much as they are meant to be continuous with melee weapons, especially as spears work in both ways. I did make it so that throwing weapons (i) sometimes are found in stacks and (ii) all have the standard weight. These things help a bit and (i) allows for occasional useful fine or special throwing weapons.

Perhaps I could stop most special types appearing on throwing weapons? Perhaps I could stop them being generated fine (i.e. the bonus to melee or damage sides)? At the moment, I often prefer to find a normal spear than a special or fine one... The main problem with these things is that spears and to a lesser extent daggers are meant to be melee weapons too. Any ideas?

[Derakon]

It sounds like the main problem is trying to make weapons that are both melee and throwing weapons. In reality I don't think things worked this way much -- you had javelins for throwing and spears for melee, and special throwing daggers that didn't have the standard hilt that a melee weapon would. Are people actually using throwing weapons as melee weapons? I'm inclined to say you should just make them be throwing weapons, period, and do whatever limitations you need to to make them work well in that role. There's plenty of normal melee weapons, so losing a couple shouldn't be a big blow.

[debo]

A couple comments: The reason I went with power is because I was fairly sure I wanted to go heavy weapons, combined with the knowledge that, well, if I wanted to go to the finesse tree I have melee affinity so it's not a big deal (can always turn power off if need be). Power is also more reliable than finesse, especially with a lower than normal dex (and having 3 str).

I'm not sure why I left that mail of protection the ground, I do remember thinking about it and making some sort of judgement call on it, but not exactly why. Probably it's because I had found that [-2,1d7] studded leather and I have a habit of eschewing things with penalties early on, but it still would have made sense to carry it. Despite what it might have seemed before then, my thought generally is to have as little penalty as possible early (which I think you go with too). I'm not really sure why I didn't wear a shield though! Especially that [+0,1d4] round shield.

The time where I deliberated whether to get charge, I checked my weapon weights and (I assume) wouldn't be getting full sides, so I didn't want to commit to it. I spend a lot of time agonising over what abilities to get, honestly I don't even remember what I ended up with.

I didn't pick up that throwing axe because it wouldn't stack, the only time I will carry one that won't stack is if it's an unidentified ego item (then I'll likely drop it after I ID it).

Yes, I do often ditch things with penalties early on. Great insight on the power thing, it never occurred to me to turn it off

Do you mind if I post these comments on the video itself?

[debo]

It sounds like the main problem is trying to make weapons that are both melee and throwing weapons. In reality I don't think things worked this way much -- you had javelins for throwing and spears for melee, and special throwing daggers that didn't have the standard hilt that a melee weapon would. Are people actually using throwing weapons as melee weapons? I'm inclined to say you should just make them be throwing weapons, period, and do whatever limitations you need to to make them work well in that role. There's plenty of normal melee weapons, so losing a couple shouldn't be a big blow.

So, this is interesting, because I do use spears as both throwing weapons and as melee weapons often. I think more people should use throwing axes as melee weapons (with Naugrim esp.) which I don't think many people do -- I mentioned once I'd like to see them renamed as 'hand axes' to make this more obvious.

I only ever use daggers for throwing, except for the artefact ones (which I use both for melee and throwing).

My question is: are we considering this as a programming obstacle, or as deliberate limitation in the game mechanics? I think the ideal situation is that all my throwing axes should stack in the same "slot", regardless of their type, bonuses etc. Would you consider this a gamebreaking mechanic, or just a right pain in the arse to code / design UI for?

I think the other option is to give 2 "quivers" for throwing weapons, where you can only stack throwing weapons of identical affix / weight / melee / sides. Doesn't make much sense I guess, but I believe other variants have throwing quivers so there would at least be reference code to work from.

I would be sad to see the fine types disappear from spears especially, as I use those in melee fairly often, and they're all useful.

[debo]

What if you just kept all the fine/special stuff the same, but simply increased the average stack size for daggers, spears, and throwing axes? That way I can choose between carrying around e.g. 10-12 vanilla spears, or five fine spears of doriath?

Usually what happens now is I find 1 fine, special spear, maybe one throwing axe of hador's house with good melee/damage sides, and then 12 vanilla throwing axes, so I just end up throwing out everything but the big stack. This way, I'd always at least have a reasonable decision to make re: what to ditch and what to keep. One throwing weapon on its own is relatively useless, unless it's something as badass as Aeglos.

Also, throwing axes could definitely stand to have some of their special types trimmed IMO. A throwing axe that gives whirlwind or follow-through is not very useful, even if we are considering using them as melee weapons in certain situations.

[HallucinationMushroom]

Every time I come across a 2d6 throwing axe , I think, this would be so *awesome* for subtlety and rapid attack. Because, you know, a subtle axe? So cool. Sorry to slow you down. Carry on.

[Philip]

I agree with Derakon. Simply split spears into spears and javelins, daggers into daggers and throwing knives, and throwing axes into throwing axes and hand axes. Then the throwing version could be much more limited in what egos it gets and also potentially modified to better balance throwing.

[half]

I agree with Derakon. Simply split spears into spears and javelins, daggers into daggers and throwing knives, and throwing axes into throwing axes and hand axes. Then the throwing version could be much more limited in what egos it gets and also potentially modified to better balance throwing.

I'm pretty sure I won't do this. I'm very happy with the limited range of weapons in Sil and am not interested in solutions to this rather small problem that involve adding things. The design philosophy of Sil is much more about subtracting things (e.g. removing special item types from throwing weapons).