Angband 4.2.0

[Gwarl]

Another possible bug, but one that has probably been around for awhile and I just noticed. When fighting a Black-Hearted Huorn, and using the Pike 'Til-i-arc', the weapon keeps "freezing" the monster. Til-i-arc can both freeze and burn opponents and the monster is supposed to particularly susceptible to fire. I assume since the message is "freezing", that @ is being denied the extra damage that should be accorded due to the monster's susceptibility.

Had the monster been resistant to cold, the weapon would be burning. Shouldn't it be doing whatever damage is greatest? In this case, burning.

This might be a bug where freezing is displayed and burning is happening, rather than freezing being correctly displayed as happening in lieu of burning.

At least, my variant has a bug like this.

[Hounded]

Throwing & Other Observations

So I'm working my way through my second character under 4.2.0. First round was a Half-Troll Fighter (my standard re-establish monster memory and get acquainted with the game choice) who got in deep with some Hydrae just before a Shadow Drake appeared through the wall.

Second round I'm trying a Druid (and loving it I might add). No real perspective from the other classes so far but I'm leaning towards a Necromancer for round three. So much for context.

1) Starting the Dunedain Druid was confusing. I was excited by Fox Form but took a while to figure out what it was good for as whenever I did manage to hit something with my whip (starting equipment) the damage penalty cancelled it out more often then not. I also (for some insane reason) didn't realize that the damage calculation in the alternate form would be re-calculated by viewing the weapon. I was putzing around trying to do the math on the character screen and wondering what possible value could be gleaned from the alternate forms if I lost the weapon damage (again, the 1d3 whip muddied the water here as it matched the 1d3 of fists). Anyhow I've a handle on all that now but it would have been nice if how all that worked was clearer somehow.

2) Maybe I watched Disney's Sword in the Stone or enjoyed Injun-Joe-Listens-to-Wind beating up the Skinwalker in Dresden files too much but my imagination would love to be able to switch directly from form to form without having to revert to human every time. (Kudos that reverting to human doesn't take a round. That's a huge lifesaver and balances out the lack of inventory use nicely).

3) Tile gaffes (Shockbolt set). "Tamers" look like giant red centipedes. Eastern Dwarves still look like Drow (mentioned another time but re-stating here for continuity). No tile for Throwing Hammers. (Figured those are worth mentioning). Also how about alternate tiles for the different forms a Druid takes?

4) Conclusion on the stair generation only at the end of dead-end corridors or conglomerating all in one special room: Meh. I don't like it but it can be lived with. Personally I can't recall ever being one-shotted off a staircase. One of the dangers of arriving on a new room is that you're prepared to get away from your drop point and don't start off by lighting everything up and announcing your presence when you've no idea what's around you.

5) I'm always disappointed when I find the Special Ego weapons. Inevitably I have a better artifact long before I encounter a widget of Westerness/Gondolin/Lothlorien. Perhaps it's my playing style (grinder who clears every level and cheerfully burns an hour playing cat and mouse chiselling a unique I should just be leaving alone) and if I dove more aggressively they wouldn't be so anticlimactic (in which case I retract the following) but beyond atmosphere they really don't seem to contribute to the actual game play. Not sure how this might be balanced.

6) I wonder if Ents should have some ability to wake up Old Forest Trees and polymorph them into Huorns (cause apparently I'm a masochist to even think of that).

7) Throwing. Again this one really speaks to my imagination (thank you Count Rugen, Chingchgook and the ninjae from Shogun). Love the addition of the throwing hammers and had some thoughts on expanding along that theme.

- How about an ego throwing hammer that returns to sender (think Mjolnir or Aegis Fang). Maybe a better concept as an artifact but not sure if there's any reasonable precedent in Tolkien lore. Would hate to suddenly mix in random Norse mythology here.

- Throwing Axes anyone?

- Most thrown weapons are lighter and generally only effective based upon perfect placement or due to poisons of some sort. Possibly some sort of damage multiplier based upon a "Throwing" skill to make up for the lousy base damage which one would have on throwing knives or shuriken (yeah I know those aren't in there but I can dream).

(and here I start to ramble)

- Maybe some suitable treatments using the enchantment system for small thrown blades. Think soporific (sleep), paralytic (hold monster), or confusing agents in addition to just regular old poison.

- Hey! That would really transfer over nicely to a new blowgun/dart ranged weapon. Could be a good complementary weapon for rogues, blackguards, necromancers... druids and rangers too but questions on the morality of using poisons... (as though any @ isn't sociopathic to an alarming degree).

- Rather than finding "enchanted" darts/throwing knives/shuriken how about a variation on the old Elemental Brand spell for certain classes. It can only be applied to "throwing" weapons or darts but would give that batch one of the above-mentioned "poison" effects.

- Now... how about an Atlatl that can be used with a spear like Nimloth or a Rocke- {urk}

Obviously I'm really enjoying all of the new twists. Thank you again Nick for all of your hard work and everybody else for the collaboration and atmosphere to be enjoyed here.

[Nick]

Thanks for all the comments, interesting and helpful.

Throwing.

Throwing axes already exist.

The whole throwing mechanic is only very recent. It could certainly do with some work, thanks for the ideas.

[Ingwe Ingweron]

Why isn't the rune of aggravation learned when you can observe monsters waking up the moment @ wields the relevant item? It appears the only way to learn it is using a scroll, but it seems to me to be appropriate for id-by-use.

[wobbly]

"The 9-headed hydra fiddles with the lock". Ah what?

[Hounded]

"The 9-headed hydra fiddles with the lock". Ah what?

And now I have the perfect example of the difference between "oral dexterity" and "verbal dexterity".

[MattB]

Trap immunity?? Awesome!! :-D

[gglibertine]

Just found an Amulet of Adornment and suddenly wondered why the game doesn't tell me, "You feel pretty!" when I wear it. (In fact, I think it should say, "You feel pretty, and witty, and GAAAAAAAY!" but maybe that's just me.)

[fph]

Now that one doesn't have to spend a scroll to ID them anymore, amulets of adornment feel even more useless. Maybe it's time to have them go? Is there a more interesting mechanic that could replace them for a very low-tier amulet that doesn't ID immediately and gets confused for resist acid/lightning?

[wobbly]

Bring back charisma. Also haggling.

butchered

More seriously there's already a few that fit that description like slow digestion, infravision (useful but far from amazing). You could maybe add something with rfear similar to rings of the dog. Pretty sure if you just went through all the possible flags you'd find something that works as a low tier amulet.

Edit: How about amulets of exploding?

OF(SUST_STR)
OF(SUST_INT)
OF(SUST_WIS)
OF(SUST_DEX)
OF(SUST_CON)
OF(PROT_FEAR)
OF(PROT_BLIND)
OF(PROT_CONF)
OF(PROT_STUN)
OF(SLOW_DIGEST)
OF(FEATHER)
OF(REGEN)
OF(TELEPATHY)
OF(SEE_INVIS)
OF(FREE_ACT)
OF(HOLD_LIFE)
OF(IMPACT)
OF(BLESSED)
OF(BURNS_OUT)
OF(TAKES_FUEL)
OF(NO_FUEL)
OF(IMPAIR_HP)
OF(IMPAIR_MANA)
OF(AFRAID)
OF(NO_TELEPORT)
OF(AGGRAVATE)
OF(DRAIN_EXP)
OF(STICKY)
OF(FRAGILE)
OF(LIGHT_1)
OF(LIGHT_2)
OF(DIG_1)
OF(DIG_2)
OF(DIG_3)
OF(EXPLODE)
OF(MAX)

[gglibertine]

Bring back charisma. Also haggling.

I'd be down with charisma coming back if it enabled you to charm monsters into helping you instead of attacking you.

In the days when dinosaurs roamed the Earth, my roommate and I created a Guitarist class for Nethack. The guitar functioned as a battleaxe (of course), and there were throwing picks for a distance weapon. If you played your guitar to a nymph, she would giggle and throw her panties at you, which you could wear as a +1 helmet for no good reason.

Give me a break, it was the 80s and I was 19.

[Diego Gonzalez]

I'd be down with charisma coming back if it enabled you to charm monsters into helping you instead of attacking you.

In the days when dinosaurs roamed the Earth, my roommate and I created a Guitarist class for Nethack. The guitar functioned as a battleaxe (of course), and there were throwing picks for a distance weapon. If you played your guitar to a nymph, she would giggle and throw her panties at you, which you could wear as a +1 helmet for no good reason.

Give me a break, it was the 80s and I was 19.

And a necklace made with knobs that go to eleven...

[Pete Mack]

At one point i considered a variant where charisma would be a primary stat, somewhat in a similar vein:

https://groups.google.com/forum/m/#!searchin/rec.games.roguelike.angband/Bagpipes/rec.games.roguelike.angband/2172NfVjZfE

[Derakon]

D&D has reskinned charisma as a "force of will/presence" kind of stat, and used it as a casting stat for several classes. That said, I feel like stats should have more purpose beyond "a specific class wants it, and everyone else doesn't care". INT and WIS already have this issue, with their secondary benefits being relatively minor.

[Pete Mack]

INT has important secondary effects. Being able to use the rod of TO is a big deal. A low INT HT warrior cannot. 100% save is nice, but less important, I agree.