Angband 64 x 64 pixel tileset

[d_m]

FA has a handheld option which reduces the max range/LOS variables to something much smaller for small screens.

It might be interesting to experiment with this in V. I'm not sure if the game gets easier, harder, or just different, but it would certainly help the situation with large tiles!

[buzzkill]

If you've never played with tiles, the you're probably overestimating the "grave danger" that arises from having a smaller world view. It's not that bad, though certainly a disadvantage of sorts. I always play 32x32 and seldom look outside the visible with the express purpose of scanning for (yet undetected) dangerous enemies. I've always felt that in game messages "A foo appears (off screen, west)", or even an audible warning as simple as a "ping" would suffice. The only time it gets kinda harrowing is when wandering through the FA wilderness, the plains to be precise. 64x64, well that might be a different story.

[Susramanian]

ToME went from a view distance of 20 down to 10 because of Shockbolt's tiles. I still use ASCII instead of Shockbolt's tiles, because I like to be able to see the whole zone at once, so I didn't really benefit from the change. I thought the view distance halving would have a huge impact on gameplay, but I barely even noticed, strangely.

[Shockbolt]

ToME went from a view distance of 20 down to 10 because of Shockbolt's tiles. I still use ASCII instead of Shockbolt's tiles, because I like to be able to see the whole zone at once, so I didn't really benefit from the change. I thought the view distance halving would have a huge impact on gameplay, but I barely even noticed, strangely.

I don't get the downscale from 20 to 10, I got at least 20 tiles upwards/downwards when playing at 64x64 using my tiles in ToME, and an even greater number of tiles sideways.

That said, playing in 64x64 is just one of many options, so nobody is forced to use that scale if they're playing on tiny screens. And nobody is being forced to play with my tilesets, either for Angband or ToME, as the other old options are still in place.

[d_m]

I don't get the downscale from 20 to 10, I got at least 20 tiles upwards/downwards when playing at 64x64 using my tiles in ToME, and an even greater number of tiles sideways.

The issue is that if max range is 20 then you need 41x41 or so in order to see your full targeting/targeted range.

It may not be a big deal... we'll see.

[Magnate]

The issue is that if max range is 20 then you need 41x41 or so in order to see your full targeting/targeted range.

It may not be a big deal... we'll see.

I don't see why we couldn't shrink max range, sight range, detection range, missile range and spells. What's wrong with 14 or so?

[Derakon]

I don't see why we couldn't shrink max range, sight range, detection range, missile range and spells. What's wrong with 14 or so?

Well, among other things, the Hellpit vault gets a bit easier. I suspect there are lots of ways the sight/targeting radius impacts gameplay; changing it is easy but recognizing what effects that has is hard. I do think it could be worth trying though.

[nppangband]

I don't see why we couldn't shrink max range, sight range, detection range, missile range and spells. What's wrong with 14 or so?

It would make it significantly easier to clear out nests & pits. The player should be able to get in closer & use area effect spells (dispel evil) on half the room without having as many monsters able to retaliate.

[will_asher]

It would make it significantly easier to clear out nests & pits. The player should be able to get in closer & use area effect spells (dispel evil) on half the room without having as many monsters able to retaliate.

If they lower max range & sight range, it would apply both to the PC and to monsters. Even area effect spells don't go past max range, so pits wouldn't be any easier except maybe that less monsters would have los on the doorway at the same time. But any monsters the PC could reach could also reach the PC.

I'm also curious to see the effects of this & if it might be a good idea.

[nppangband]

If they lower max range & sight range, it would apply both to the PC and to monsters. Even area effect spells don't go past max range, so pits wouldn't be any easier except maybe that less monsters would have los on the doorway at the same time. But any monsters the PC could reach could also reach the PC.

I'm also curious to see the effects of this & if it might be a good idea.

That's what I mean. So it would be much safer to quickly run up to the door or cast stone-to-mud on one wall of a pit and start casting area-effect spells. The fact that you can only damage half the pit is little downside compared to the upside of knowing only half the pit can cast spells at you.

[buzzkill]

I don't see why we couldn't shrink max range, sight range, detection range, missile range and spells. What's wrong with 14 or so?

I implore you to play it (with tiles), before you try to slap a quick fix on it. This is a huge change that doesn't necessarily need to happen and will cause ripple effects yet to be imagined. It's not that big of a deal, and if it turns out that the community feels that I'm wrong and something needs to be done, I can't help but think that there may well be better ways of dealing with it.

[Nick]

I don't see why we couldn't shrink max range, sight range, detection range, missile range and spells. What's wrong with 14 or so?

The FA small device mode (a) changed this to 10 and (b) was a birth option.

It may have made the game slightly easier; it's hard to tell when all your test characters die early...

[will_asher]

I implore you to play it (with tiles), before you try to slap a quick fix on it. This is a huge change that doesn't necessarily need to happen and will cause ripple effects yet to be imagined. It's not that big of a deal, and if it turns out that the community feels that I'm wrong and something needs to be done, I can't help but think that there may well be better ways of dealing with it.

The way I see it, vanilla has gotten to be the opposite of the way it used to be. It used to be that variants experiemented with the new ideas and if they were good, then vanilla adopted them. Now, it's vanilla that experiements with new ideas and if I like them, I consider adding them to DaJAngband...

[Shockbolt]

Tonights tile update for Angband, decided to go after the recent replacements for the various angels. I might have missed someone of them in this update, the others will make it into another update later on:



Not sure if the Knights Templar was replaced, but I took the liberty of painting a White Knight instead, seen to the far right.

[Derakon]

I took the liberty of painting a White Knight instead, seen to the far right.

The phrasing on that amuses me.