What was the item on your early x-9 level ?

[Pete Mack]

!enlughtenment isnt all that deep an object. Surprising it can generate a -9 feeling.

[forenmagra]

4-9 feeling, seems to have been triggered by Potion of *Enlightenment* at DL12

[ElmerHomero]

I don't believe drops improve level feeling - only what's on the floor.

Indeed. I guess I should have phrased thing differently. With the "[g]o figure" I did not mean to imply that the level feelings should have been higher because of the ring. Instead, I meant to indicate my surprise with the One Ring being dropped by a young and insignificant dragon .

[sffp]

In the aftergame, at DL 107 with 5-5 level feelings, a young white dragon dropped the Ring of Power 'The One Ring'. Go figure.

I don't believe drops improve level feeling - only what's on the floor.

[ElmerHomero]

For X-Y, X is the monster ... Y is the treasure level...

A monster pit will inflate the first number...

Playing 4.2.2. Somewhere before DL 30, I found a 9-9 level: I managed to clear a pit of demons and my reward was Wizard's Tome of Power (almost useless as apart from Shock Wave, I had no access to the other spells yet).

A number of things do not figure into the treasure number (monster drops, loot in chests, loot in rubble).

In the aftergame, at DL 107 with 5-5 level feelings, a young white dragon dropped the Ring of Power 'The One Ring'. Go figure.

[Pete Mack]

@sky--
I find this utterly unconvincing. First, you suggest that the game should be balanced for randarts, which is impossible. Further, when I find a MoD of Gondolin as a mage, it's a fun change to go hunting. Add in rune and shockwave/ice storm, and you can fight Horned Reapers.*

I don't see anything wrong with this.

*if you really want to--they have no drop.

[Sky]

my reasoning is based on playing with randarts.

Randart games either are, or aren't overpowered. When they are, it's overboard with the overpoweredness. I very rarely find a randart set that "is a tiny bit too strong". Generally it means it's either got off-hand extra blows, or it doesn't. (sometimes it's not a weapon, it can be am armor with very high bonuses, or a high speed bonus, etc)

Mages in randart games either belong to group A and win by TO and then directly to manastorm, or to group B when they find something that allows them to melee even strong uniques, and - look at my characters - this happens, a lot.

A mage should not be able to rely on melee, specially deeper down.
4 blows is not weak. 300+ DPS is not weak.

If you want to play a class that can Mass-Banish entire vaults at the time or clear an entire level of all demons, then you need to pay the price.

Enchanting and berserk need to come back for flavour, not for a practical reason.

[Estie]

Tensers prior value stemmed from the fact that melee/archery was a mages best damage option in the lategame, so berserk and enchanting enhanced that. Now that his spell and device output has been buffed, the melee oriented spells arent all that useful whether thematic or not. The remaining role for melee is to equip something like a MoD of Gondolin and level up on susceptible mobs with few clicks. Killing anything dangerous is done with spell or wand.

So...why do you want to nerf his melee, it is below the threshold anyway.

[Sky]

i find it upsetting that Tensner has so few spells as a mage, so even though i said it before, i will say it again here. In the hopes that Nick one day decides to release 4.1.Sky-knows with all the changes i requested.

Tensner is a D&D lore persona, and the spells in the book are already existent in the D&D game.

Spells like Berserk are classic Mage spells. If anything, *at least* Berserk should be reinstated.

Yeah yeah, ok so mages are already too powerful. Who cares.
Enchanting items is also something which in the D&D world only mages do. And let's not pretend that Angband isn't almost completely lifted off of D&D.

As it stands Tensner is almost useless to mages. Greater Recharging is limited to two uses, recharging Annihilation prior to Mana Storm, and recharging staves of Banishment prior, again, to acquiring Keleks. All for a slot and a book that rates as LF -7 at native depths.
Basically you cast the spells once for XP and then sell it. No way that is worth an equipment slot.
Enchanting crossbow bolts is useless when you have endless lightning/fire/mana/ice/acid/sound/shards bolts+balls at your disposal.

The truth is that Mages should be capped at 3 blows, not 4 ...

[Jay]

Tenser's Transformations showed up on DL21. The good news is my @ is a mage, but I won't be able to use it for a while.

It's been a truly weird game so far — the only decent level feelings I've had have led to a RoDetection and a RoFireballs, which are useful enough, but my only source of FA at this point is an amulet of inertia. Stingy old RNG!

[forenmagra]

Playing with selling off, so I just kept them around to swap and for early projectile damage.

[Sky]

Cold.

sell that Fire sucker.

Hydras. You do not need to worry about undead yet.

[forenmagra]

Only a dungeon feeling of 1-7, but managed to find Nimthanc and Narthanc lying on the floor with my Warrior on floor one. Absolutely stunned, having 130 damage per round against enemies that don't resist fire and cold seems insane that early.

[fph]

Incidentally, why are adamantine plate mails so heavy? Adamantine in D&D is light, see e.g. https://olddungeonmaster.com/2016/12...-of-materials/ , and I assume it is based on diamonds in real life, which are lighter than most metals.

[Pete Mack]

I just found a weak amulet of trickery on dl 19, LF 3-9. +1 dex an speed isn't much, but +4 infravision is nice for a Dunadan without SI. Not to mention +2 steslth, rPoison and rNexus