Bugs and complaints on current master

[Sky]

If you're using windows, I think it's probably this one.

unfortunately, i have found out that this build also has the same bug.

[Tibarius]

monster-recall information

I believe the color code in the monster-recall window is currently this:
red = no protection / resistance
yellow = resistance present
green = immune or resistance in case of non-basic elements like nether

I am rather sure to have lost characters from single attacks against elements which were shown in green value (because the damage delivered with resistance still was more than the chars maximum HPs were).

So better use this:
red = character can be killed with a single attack of that attack form
yellow = character cannot be killed with one attack, but could take more than 20% of his CURRENT HPs
green = character can only be damaged for less than 20% of his CURRENT HPs

[Derakon]

So better use this:
red = character can be killed with a single attack of that attack form
yellow = character cannot be killed with one attack, but could take more than 20% of his CURRENT HPs
green = character can only be damaged for less than 20% of his CURRENT HPs

This discussion would probably be suited to a new thread, since it's a feature request rather than an issue with the nightly build. There are details such as what to do about monster memory, whether damage should even be as high as it is, etc. that would need to be addressed. I encourage you to make a new thread for that purpose.

[Sky]

derp derp [deleted]

[Tibarius]

level feelings

I play 4.0.4 with option 'loosing artefacts when leaving level' on. There were a few levels i left without having the $ (artefact) level feeling noticed. So i think if that option is turned on and there is an artefact on the level, then the player should be noticed upon level entry. Else he can miss it completely without even knowing it was there.

[Derakon]

I play 4.0.4 with option 'loosing artefacts when leaving level' on. There were a few levels i left without having the $ (artefact) level feeling noticed. So i think if that option is turned on and there is an artefact on the level, then the player should be noticed upon level entry. Else he can miss it completely without even knowing it was there.

If you leave the level before giving it enough time to generate the treasure level feeling, then that's just a risk you're taking. The entire point of delaying the treasure feeling is to keep players from bouncing between two levels until they get a good level feeling (level scumming); giving them an instant $ feeling would undo that fix.

[Tibarius]

re: level feeling

Your statement is not fully true Derakon. It is only true for artefacts. The level feelings for treasures on level 1-9 would still NOT instantly show up.

And i would disagree to you, if you use the option to loose artefacts leaving a level i would consider it better to know if one is on the level at once.

[Derakon]

Your statement is not fully true Derakon. It is only true for artefacts. The level feelings for treasures on level 1-9 would still NOT instantly show up.

And i would disagree to you, if you use the option to loose artefacts leaving a level i would consider it better to know if one is on the level at once.

So what's to stop me from bouncing from level to level until I get a $ feeling? That sounds like exactly the kind of behavior the delayed level feeling is meant to stop.

[Pete Mack]

Right. It used to be you'd get 'looks like any other level' if you spent too little time on a given level--meaning there's no way to know if there's an artifact on the level. Now you don't get a level feeling until you've spent enough time on the level. If you miss an artifact, well, that's the risk of using the birth option.

[Nick]

Latest build on the nightlies page now has a new monster pathfinding algorithm. This is going to change monster behaviour - mostly for the better, I hope, but it will be a bit unpredictable.

Please let me know about the gameplay effect of these changes, positive or negative. I am expecting to have to make further amendments to pathfinding; I am thinking of the current situation as a base to build on.

My current plan is to do a little bugfixing now, and then get on to the monster list revamp, which is the last remaining major pre-4.1 task.

[Gwarl]

I'm compiling the lastest release now for a test run - can I request that the git contain a version file, as the makefile seems happier when it gets one?

Also, this build tells me I'm missing libpng12.dll, an error I haven't had before, using windows 10. Easily fixed but I thought I'd make a note.

Finally, the build didn't make save and score folders, and I had to add them manually to make it run, but to be fair this is probably due to using --with-no-install and building in minGW.

I should have been working on my datafile editor but irl has been busy lately and I would rather start this weekend just playing angband. I'll try and put some work in tomorrow.

[Nick]

I'm compiling the lastest release now for a test run - can I request that the git contain a version file, as the makefile seems happier when it gets one?

Also, this build tells me I'm missing libpng12.dll, an error I haven't had before, using windows 10. Easily fixed but I thought I'd make a note.

Finally, the build didn't make save and score folders, and I had to add them manually to make it run, but to be fair this is probably due to using --with-no-install and building in minGW.

There is a version.sh in the scripts directory. Which makefile are you using? I use

MINGW=yes make -f Makefile.win

from src when building on MinGW if that helps. Also you can check the buildbot page (I assume you can see that) to see how the autobuilds work.

[Sky]

again, same bug where an artifact can be generate several times.

[Gwarl]

There is a version.sh in the scripts directory. Which makefile are you using? I use

MINGW=yes make -f Makefile.win

from src when building on MinGW if that helps. Also you can check the buildbot page (I assume you can see that) to see how the autobuilds work.

Okay I see the script.

I just use ./autogen.sh && ./configure --with-options && make

Didn't realise there were makefiles for each platform! I don't really know how to use them though.

I don't know what the buildbot does, I assume it's something that might be helpful when I re-up the server for giving an option to play using the latest nightlies build.

In terms of gameplay though;

My gnome rogue died after I a) dropped my scrolls of satsify hunger after learning the spell b) quaff-ID'd salt water c) chain paralyzed by hunger before I could make it back to where I dropped my scrolls. So I never got telepathy and couldn't really see how the pathfinding was working. I feel like explosive breeders were a lot more of a pain but I'm not sure. I also feel like I've been getting high level devices earlier more often when playing the nightlies - in this case a staff of speed and a rod of drain life (!) by DL20.

I appreciate the efforts made toward rebalancing the status effects but there are still a lot of problems:

The usefulness of confuse monster is very slight, you might get one or two free moves before it wears off. This one has changed from 'don't bother it won't work' to 'don't bother it won't help'.

Reduced charges in the wands basically just translates to slightly higher carry weights and more combing (although I didn't really stop to comb and I built up sufficient charges simply by carrying more of the things). Additionally, there's been no corresponding reduction in max charges for staves - slow monster wand now has around 3 charges but the staff still has 5.

It's done nothing to change the fact that there's still a battle script for any tough encounter of slow+stun.

Like I said before, no-save status effects have drastic cascading effects on gameplay, they'll remain overpowered until they're nerfed to the point of uselessness (like confuse monster is at present) and any attempt to find a happy medium will just lead to tedium as you're forced to do more to get your slight advantage. Like lowering the number of charges in wands - finding fairly common wands isn't particularly dangerous or difficult (i.e. fun/challenging), simply making the player do it more often is just requiring more grind, not solving the issue of no-save status effects inevitably leading to a battle script which reduces the difficulty of tough encounters. You'd have to buff all the uniques by about half the amount status effects they aren't immune to nerf them by, and all that does is get you back where you started with more keystrokes.

I appreciate the willingness to try new things but in this case I really think the wisest course is to roll back the status effect changes and at least put them on ice until after 4.1, because all the other changes from 4.0.5 have been great and it would be a shame to see it undermined by breaking this mechanic so completely.

[PowerWyrm]

My current plan is to do a little bugfixing now, and then get on to the monster list revamp, which is the last remaining major pre-4.1 task.

IMO the monster list revamp should be left out for 4.1, which already has a ton of new features, especially if it's gonna impact the list drastically.