[Announce] FrogComposband 7.0.cloudberry released

[Sideways]

I think the ammo break chances on the Sniper's Holy Shot might be off... I haven't been keeping an exact count but it feels much higher than the 4% chance listed in my stats.

Also, the shots that guarantee ammo break don't mention it at all, either. When browsed they still say 4%.

Yeah, the breakage chances listed don't account for sniping at all. I'll fix that, thanks for reporting.

Holy Shot has a 40% breakage chance.

[Derakon]

I think that's the first time I've seen someone report "this seems to be failing way more often than it should" and they were actually right.

[Benly]

Playing a Possessor and occupying Robin Hood's body, I used the Major Trap power and got a trap that, when the enemy triggered it, spawned a huge pool full of giant piranhas which were all hostile to me. This is kind of hilarious, but is it supposed to work like that?

[Sideways]

Playing a Possessor and occupying Robin Hood's body, I used the Major Trap power and got a trap that, when the enemy triggered it, spawned a huge pool full of giant piranhas which were all hostile to me. This is kind of hilarious, but is it supposed to work like that?

I had to look that up. The piranhas should always generate as friendly if you're a Rogue, but can generate as either friendly or hostile for classes other than Rogue.

As a Possessor you don't count as a Rogue, even though you're occupying Robin Hood's body (and Robin Hood's pseudo-class is Rogue). Possibly I should make the trap check your pseudo-class so you'd always get friendly piranhas in Robin's body.

[Benly]

I had to look that up. The piranhas should always generate as friendly if you're a Rogue, but can generate as either friendly or hostile for classes other than Rogue.

As a Possessor you don't count as a Rogue, even though you're occupying Robin Hood's body (and Robin Hood's pseudo-class is Rogue). Possibly I should make the trap check your pseudo-class so you'd always get friendly piranhas in Robin's body.

I see! Thanks for the response. I thought it was pretty funny but it does kind of interfere with the ability's usefulness.

[CyclopsSlayer]

Item use bug?

Playing a werewolf char at Clvl 8 so with terrible Int/Wis currently. A _traps has a 75% failure chance in Wolf form. I have the option 'Automatically detect traps while running' set to ON.

If I run to the edge of a Trap detected zone it seems to trigger the staff or scroll without fail, while using them manually it fails as expected.

Is it doing multiple tries behind the scenes and not reporting it, or is it using a seeming 100% success method?

edit: Have the quest _Enlightenment now, 92% fail, and it works seemingly without fall with Auto map while running is on.

[CyclopsSlayer]

Suggestion

Much as Werewolves have troubles with Silver, should the 'evil' races have an issue with 'holy' equipment?
It just seems wrong for my Balrog to be running around with a Long Sword (Blessed)?

[Sideways]

Playing a werewolf char at Clvl 8 so with terrible Int/Wis currently. A _traps has a 75% failure chance in Wolf form. I have the option 'Automatically detect traps while running' set to ON.

If I run to the edge of a Trap detected zone it seems to trigger the staff or scroll without fail, while using them manually it fails as expected.

Is it doing multiple tries behind the scenes and not reporting it, or is it using a seeming 100% success method?

edit: Have the quest _Enlightenment now, 92% fail, and it works seemingly without fall with Auto map while running is on.

Yeah, devices always work when used for auto-detection (same as with auto-identify). That's simply to save time and get the same thing done in the end anyway, which I've always presumed (and presumably the original auto-detection coder presumed too) is what people who like auto-detection want

The only exception is that Berserkers still retain their 100% fail.

Interesting idea about the evil races. Would help nerf Balrogs a bit maybe

[CyclopsSlayer]

re: Auto skills
Seems somewhat like an exploit. heh.
Reach the edge of a Mapped area, Click _Enlightenment 20 times before it works, or, autorun and tap a move key immediately to break it, but have the detect go off 100%. hmm...

=-=-=-
Playing a Balrog Chaos-Warrior atm, and that is all you need to nerf a Balrog, lol. Just had my stats shufflef at L20, I can barely hold my Long Sword now...

[TauzentBlitz]

On a skillmaster with throwing, dual wielding weapons causes the second weapon to get better stats (Higher multiplier and catch chance) in the character sheet.

The Ring monster race desperately needs some way to boost its max HP. With 10 base hp going past floor 35-ish is suicide without grinding out every single resistance (which takes a very long time at that depth), and I'm not sure you'll ever get enough hp to avoid getting 1-shot by a bad mana storm.

[Sideways]

The last ring winner is Aver's from PosChengband 7.0.2; and the only changes to rings since then should make them easier; so ring ought to be winnable.

I'll look into the skillmaster thing, thanks.

[CyclopsSlayer]

I've seen this issue before and have shrugged it off, but it does lead me to wonder about a problem with the core Math routines in Frog and many other *bands.

The particular issue I saw today;

A pair of soft leather boots was selling for 10 gold.
A pair of soft leather boots, 25% off, was selling for 9 gold.

I can think of no math that would allow this. IF the base boots were actually 10.7 then the reduced cost with round up would be 9 gold, BUT then the base boots should be 11.

1 gold is not the issue, it is that this seems to indicate a flaw in the base math routines.

[Sideways]

I think that has to do with the order in which certain things are calculated. In this case the boots probably have a "real" value of 6, which becomes 5 after the discount is applied and the resulting value is rounded up. Then that's multiplied by some factor in the store, and if that factor is something like 1.73, you get 6*1.73=10.38=10 and 5*1.73=8.65=9.

Although it may seem odd to apply the discount so early (and that is the root cause of the weird prices you're seeing), from a coding point of view it's easier to do it that way.

[CyclopsSlayer]

I think that has to do with the order in which certain things are calculated. In this case the boots probably have a "real" value of 6, which becomes 5 after the discount is applied and the resulting value is rounded up. Then that's multiplied by some factor in the store, and if that factor is something like 1.73, you get 6*1.73=10.38=10 and 5*1.73=8.65=9.

Although it may seem odd to apply the discount so early (and that is the root cause of the weird prices you're seeing), from a coding point of view it's easier to do it that way.

Ah, okay. Yes applying the discount early makes the process order dubious.

Is the same true of other things, Saves, Fails, To-Hit, Damage, etc...??

[Sideways]

I'm not sure how the concept would even apply to something like saves or fails or to-hit.

And discounts have that process order for a reason - it means all discounts can be calculated once in one place in the code, and don't need to be separately applied by every piece of code that wants a discounted price, and item values don't need any scaling. It makes the code a lot easier to maintain, and the errors in shop prices that result from it are very minor.

Could I fix it with some hack - "apply the discount later in this special case", and then do the applying where necessary - sure, but it wouldn't be a good return on the coding investment.