Halls of Mist 1.3.0

[Mikko Lehtinen]

I need some help in determining how good different weapons are at parrying.

My possibly faulty rules of thumb:

• Swords are good at parrying. Thin and light swords like rapier are worse at parrying than heavier swords; likewise, the heaviest two-handed swords aren't that good at parrying. Flexible swords that can be used either one- or two-handed are the best, since you can always adapt to the situation.
• Quarterstaves are up there with the swords.

Here's my list so far. Many of the throwing weapons on the list double as light melee weapons. Opinions?


Doesn't help parrying:

dart
lead-weighted dart (Romans used these)
dread spike (made-up thrown weapon)


Helps parrying a little:

dagger
dirk
grain flail
flail
stiletto
nunchaku
hurlbat (an entirely metal throwing axe)
throwing axe
javelin
dire flail
seeker stiletto (made-up thrown weapon)
cat-o-nine-tails
maul
double-ball flail
great hammer


Average at parrying:

killer stick (African thrown club)
small sword
hand axe
club
mace
morning star
truncheon
warhammer
windhammer (made-up thrown weapon)
baculus (a mace with a different name)
pilum (Roman long javelin)


Above average at parrying:

rapier
thinblade
three-piece-staff
lucerne hammer (polearm with a spike/hammer atop a long pole)
claymore (Scottish two-handed sword)
two-handed sword
zweihänder (German two-handed sword)
executioner's sword (made-up superweapon from Moria)
espadon (yet another two-handed sword)


Good at parrying:

arming sword (= short sword)
gladius (Roman short sword)
scimitar
flamberge (in Mist, a slightly heavier rapier with a waved blade)
spatha (Roman longsword)
falchion


Excellent at parrying:

battlestaff
broadsword
longsword
quarterstaff

[buzzkill]

... more in game random thoughts

• minor: If I have nothing to identify, then no warning about descending without using all my ID points. (ditto other profs).
• I wouldn't mind the R)est option modified, that is "for a while" (50 turns or full whichever come first) as the default and only. Resting for shorter periods could be accomplished with the 5 key. Longer by pressing R more than once. Resting to full health not only takes 2 keystorkes, but also wastes turns, since full health is often unnecessary unless attacked on the very next turn. I've found that 50 turns works well for all XP levels, though in dire situations you may have to rest 2 or 3 times.
• The whole Ironband mana thing seems very OK, not what I was expecting. But there has to be a better, more complicated solution .
• Shield spell gives message "you feel your skin harden" (old stoneskin).
• The torch of truth works very nicely, summons can be very nearly, but not quite entirely ignored.
• Poisoning can get quite severe and there is no way to know how poisoned you are. A more nuanced poisoned indicator would be nice (Poison, Poisx2, Poisx4, Poisx8), like with the flavored cut/would descriptions.
• I found an ego torch of Thievery (-4). Are cursed ego torches intended?

[buzzkill]

I've been thinking about Telekinesis myself.

... taking objects from the floor (or even other monsters) and throwing them. Items (maybe tables) could be hurled at enemies causing damage. Smaller enemies could be thrown at walls (tables, statues) or other enemies causing some damage, but mostly stunning and fear. Just thinking out loud.

Aside, is it possible to KO monsters in Mist. I've become quite good at delivering chained criticals ("it is stunned. It is more stunned"). I was just wondering if it is possible to reach a threshold where the enemy is non-responsive.

[Mikko Lehtinen]

A monster status effect that makes the target monster radiate a damaging aura of Fire or Frost might be tactically interesting. The monster wouldn't suffer himself but would damage nearby monsters or the player every turn.

EDIT: No, it would probably work better if the monster damaged himself, too.

[Mikko Lehtinen]

Reducing direct damage spells is problematic. Monsters have resists and vulnerabilities, and mages are aligned with either Fire or Frost. That's the reason for almost identical bolt and ball spells. I've already reduced bolt and ball spells to about half of the original EyAngband system.

Flaming Hands and Mana Ray are different damage spells. Optimizing your mana/damage ratio does require tactical thinking and moving around.

Have you tried the high level spell Curse All? It uses up a cursed item in your inventory. Other spells like this would be cool.

1. Aerosolize potion - would cause a potion to explode in a cloud surrounding a monster. Potions of poison would cause a stinking cloud like effect, potions of confusion would cause confusion etc. Could replace some of the direct damage spells.

Too much overlap with powders. All powder vials will have radius in the future if you succeed in (another) Aim skill check.

Wind Control spell is a possibility. It increases powder radius and makes it more likely that nearby phantasms dissolve. (There's already a Ring of Wind Control.)

EDIT: Enchanting powders would perhaps be more in the mage's style. The spell would turn a stack of Powder Vials of Ghost-Dark into Enchanted Powder Vials of Ghost-Dark.

2. Telekinesis - throw one item from your inventory accurately and hard

I've been thinking about Telekinesis myself. But perhaps enchanting thrown weapons would be more interesting? There will be very interesting mechanics for throwing things.

Let's call the spell Crystal Weapon. The enchanted weapon would gain a random, tremendously powerful elemental brand and a big bonus to hit, but it would shatter after one full attack or a throw.

Wise mages would first confuse a monster, and then try to score a critical hit with the crystal weapon.

3. Enhance wand - would cause a wand to have greater effect, perhaps at a higher charge cost

Sounds good.

4. Tentacles - monster affected will be temporarily unable to move but can still attack you if you are adjacent and cast spells or shoot. Maybe making a successful jump roll will allow it to move again.

There are already lots of monster status effects. This sounds a bit too similar to Earthbind.

How about turning a single wall square into a Wall of Glue? Anybody getting too close would be trapped.

I'd like to add some new terrain features that are important for spellcasters. For example, Chaos-aligned areas could have elemental vortices (terrain features, not monsters). When you shoot a vortex with a bolt of matching element, it would explode in a very powerful star burst.

[Squeak]

... and perhaps mages should also have a high level spell that dispels mist monsters

[Squeak]

I think item enchantments would be nice. In general I think the mage would be more interesting if he had less direct damage spells and more spells that would enhance strategic combat.


Other ideas for mage spells:

1. Aerosolize potion - would cause a potion to explode in a cloud surrounding a monster. Potions of poison would cause a stinking cloud like effect, potions of confusion would cause confusion etc. Could replace some of the direct damage spells.

2. Telekinesis - throw one item from your inventory accurately and hard

3. Enhance wand - would cause a wand to have greater effect, perhaps at a higher charge cost

4. Tentacles - monster affected will be temporarily unable to move but can still attack you if you are adjacent and cast spells or shoot. Maybe making a successful jump roll will allow it to move again.

[Mikko Lehtinen]

A few other thoughts:

1. priest spells - I like the changes already made. It would be nice to have a remove fear + protect from fear spell. Something else that might be interesting is a spell that temporarily doubles a god's blessing - perhaps this should be followed by some penalty such as a temporary cancellation of the blessing after the duration of the spell.
2. mage spells - I find mage spells as a whole quite boring. I think there should be less damage spells and more buff spells - things that temporarily increase stats, throwing ability etc. I think this is especially interesting with the limited mana per level.
3. Powders - they are very useful in the beginning, but it seems that higher level uniques almost always resist them. Is the determination of success only dependent on the monster they are thrown at or is it in any way determined by the players stats/skills?
4. I kind of miss the boost from being close to bookshelves. Maybe give a bonus to identify checks if you are next to a bookshelf.

1. I've considered having spells like Prayer to Cyrridven in dungeon books. Mana cost would be high, but casting the spell would be identical to sacrificing a torch at Cyrridven's altar. I removed the Boldness spell when I changed the town books to always have 7 spells. Perhaps the effect could be added to Chant?

2. Temporary combat buffs are more priest's area. Permanently enchanting items (for high mana cost) might be cool for mage? Trading short term effectiveness for long term bonuses. The effects that you listed could be different crafting spells, adding abilities to non-enchanted items. Another spell I've considered is Copy Scroll.

3. Monster saves currently depend on both your and the monster's level. I'm planning to give individual saving throws to all monsters. Some high level monsters would be easy to bewitch, some low level monsters would have surprisingly high willpower.

4. Yes, why not. It makes more sense when I change Circles of Knowledge abilities to automatic but requiring two points. With the current system bookshelves and circles had too similar abilities.

[Mikko Lehtinen]

Say, another idea... I like the "You need 14 DEX to get the full 3 blows with this weapon" messages, but how about changing them to "You need 11 DEX to get another blow with this weapon, and 14 DEX to get the full 3 blows with this weapon"? This would make it easy to know if your DEX is almost enough to get another blow!

Yes, I've actually been planning to make it so.

[Mikko Lehtinen]

Oh, Mastery isn't a skill check? It's a requirement for casting spells? Or is it both?

Here's how spellcasting would work:

To cast any spell you have learned, make a Spellcasting skill check. (Say, a 70% chance.)

If your experience level is at at least 10 higher than the spell's level, you may reroll a failed skill check once. (Two tries at 70% is 91%.)

The probabilities wouldn't be too different from current individual spell fail rates.

[Squeak]

A few other thoughts:

1. priest spells - I like the changes already made. It would be nice to have a remove fear + protect from fear spell. Something else that might be interesting is a spell that temporarily doubles a god's blessing - perhaps this should be followed by some penalty such as a temporary cancellation of the blessing after the duration of the spell.
2. mage spells - I find mage spells as a whole quite boring. I think there should be less damage spells and more buff spells - things that temporarily increase stats, throwing ability etc. I think this is especially interesting with the limited mana per level.
3. Powders - they are very useful in the beginning, but it seems that higher level uniques almost always resist them. Is the determination of success only dependent on the monster they are thrown at or is it in any way determined by the players stats/skills?
4. I kind of miss the boost from being close to bookshelves. Maybe give a bonus to identify checks if you are next to a bookshelf.

[ekolis]

Say, another idea... I like the "You need 14 DEX to get the full 3 blows with this weapon" messages, but how about changing them to "You need 11 DEX to get another blow with this weapon, and 14 DEX to get the full 3 blows with this weapon"? This would make it easy to know if your DEX is almost enough to get another blow!

[ekolis]

Oh, Mastery isn't a skill check? It's a requirement for casting spells? Or is it both?

[Mikko Lehtinen]

All the power levels of a spell have their own level requirements so that wouldn't be a problem.

Basically all spells (and subspells) would have separate Learn and Mastery level requirements. I could handle Mastery more simply by just giving one reroll on a failed check.

The exact same mechanic would work with magic devices, also. Once you reach the device's Mastery level, you get one reroll on failed checks.

[ekolis]

Do you want all power levels of spells that have multiple power levels to have the same fail rate, then? I guess that would be fair, seeing as the higher levels are already less mana-efficient, trading extra mana for more raw power over time. But if you don't intend that, you could have the base spell require a Spellcasting check, and then have a Mastery check for each additional power level, so if you want to cast Fire Bolt at the fourth power level, you'd need to pass a Spellcasting check and then three Mastery checks.

edit: and perhaps you could have the spell cast at whatever power was the last success, but cost full mana, so if you failed on the second Mastery check in the above example, you'd cast Fire Bolt at power level 2, but pay the mana cost of power level 4 as if you had succeeded.

edit2: this could also allow you to get rid of the level requirements for higher power levels, as casting high power levels would still be possible, just very difficult, with a low Mastery skill!