Skills-Angband (Sangband)

[jtrowell]

[bug] dual wielding to digging tool

I found a bug (sangband windows version 1.0.0) :

- dark elf, dual wielding a short sword and a main gauche

=> I equip a digging tool using 'w', I get a warning that it will unequip both weapons, and then when the tool is equipped, the off-hand weapon (main gauche) is lost : I don't have it anymore in my equipment panel, and it is not found in the inventory.

Tried later with a broken sword in left hand, same bug

When I tried with a shield instead of dual wielding, the shield was still equipped, but moved "in the back".



Now for a comment on the game : I tried it only yesterday, but love it

The skill system is better than most level-based systems, I love that you can start a character and only later chose what classe he will really be (by chosing your magic realm and taking your oath), and the game seems easier that Crawl (was not so hard to do ) while still having enought complexity to give a challenge.

I think that I will try a Dwarven Holy warrior/Priest next, with most points going to magical infusion and forge skills.

[Leon Marrick]

Quick note:

RL affairs will keep me away for several days to a week. Will respond to points when I can.

[BDR]

It might be helpful if you told us your OS version. Vista? XP? 98? And which port are you using main-win or main-sdl? Do you have the same problem with both?

XP. The name of the file I downloaded says win on the end, so I'd guess it's main-win.

This happened to me a few more times but I can't seem to come up with a repeatable process. So far the only constant seems to be the help menu.

[BDR]

Normally, I'd just edit my post (the dislike for double-posting exists on most forums, so it's reasonable to assume it's here too), but I've found a new bug (which worked out quite handsomely in my favor, but which you'll probably find rather embarrassing):

[tt][bc=black][color=white]
                                                                                                
[color="#00F000"]BDR          [/color]##################################################################                 
[color="#00D0FF"]Rock-whipper [/color]#................................................................#                 
             #................................................................#                 
EXP       [color="#00F000"]21 [/color]#.......................######...................................#                 
AU        [color="#00F000"]84 [/color]#......########[color="#904000"]+[/color]........######........#######....#########.......#                 
[color="#909090"]K[/color][color="#904000"]}   [/color][color="#C08040"]~  )[/color][color="#904000"]]   [/color]#......#########........######........#######....#########.......#                 
STR:      [color="#00F000"]10 [/color]#......########[color="#C08040"]1[/color]........######........[color="#909090"]2[/color]######....#########.......#                 
INT:      [color="#00F000"]15 [/color]#......#########........#[color="#0000E0"]5[/color]####........#######....#########.......#                 
WIS:      [color="#00F000"]14 [/color]#.......................[color="#C0C0C0"]{[/color].............#######....########[color="#FFFF00"]8[/color].......#                 
DEX:   [color="#00F000"]18/20 [/color]#................................................................#                 
CON:      [color="#00F000"]14 [/color]#................................................................#                 
CHR:      [color="#00F000"]16 [/color]#........................[color="#C0C0C0"]t[/color].......................................#                 
             #..........>.....................................................#                 
Cur AC     [color="#00F000"]6 [/color]#.........####3........######....................................#                 
HP    [color="#FF3030"]0[/color]/  [color="#00F000"]12 [/color]#.........#####........######....[color="#C00000"]t[/color]..########........#######......#                 
             #.........#####........#####[color="#00D0FF"]4[/color].....[color="#FF3030"]@[/color].[color="#C00000"]6[/color]#######........#######......#                 
[color="#00F000"][[/color][color="#FFFF00"]**********[/color][color="#00F000"]] [/color]#.........#####........######.......########........#######......#                 
[color="#00F000"](NW 1)       [/color]#.........#####........######.......########........[color="#FF8000"]7[/color]######......#                 
[color="#00F000"][[/color][color="#FFFF00"]Mean-looki[/color][color="#00F000"]] [/color]#................................................................#                 
[color="#909090"][[/color][color="#00F000"]Innkeeper [/color][color="#909090"]] [/color]#................................................................#                 
             #................................................................#                 
             ##################################################################                 
[color="#909090"]noise                                                                                           
                                                                                                
[/color][color="#00F000"]Luck                                                                                            
  [/color]0 days  6h                                                                                    
                                                                                                
                                                                                                
                                                                                                
                                                                                                
                                                                                                
                                                                                                
[color="#606060"](no quest)                                                                                      
                                                                                                
                                                                                                
                                                                                                
                                                                                           [/color]Town 
[/color][/bc][/tt]

Of course, my natural reaction was to quickly drink a pot of cure light wounds (as I've no idea whether I can reproduce this or not, and in any case didn't really care to die in such a fashion), which the game was gracious enough to allow me to do and which enabled me to off those townsmen.

Also, in searching for my screenshot (which was not, say, in an obvious folder named 'screenshots' or such) I found the store file which spoils how the generic shopkeeps feel about bargaining (which I find most fascinating, even though I'll not necessarily need it). I also found some of the lists for artifacts (also the cursed artifacts), though now that I think about it, you probably can't really use that if artifacts only id by name once you wear it/read a scroll of *Identify*.

EDIT: Ah, yes.. now I remember something else. Is there any possible way there could be an auto-explore option? The maps actually seem even bigger than Crawl's maps, and there is an option for such there... of course, Crawl has been around for a coon's age, so it probably wouldn't happen for a while, but can I at least get some hope? :/ Clearing the dungeons of foes and swag is kind of addicting...

[Fuma]

Of course, my natural reaction was to quickly drink a pot of cure light wounds (as I've no idea whether I can reproduce this or not, and in any case didn't really care to die in such a fashion), which the game was gracious enough to allow me to do and which enabled me to off those townsmen.

You mean the 0 HP?
It's intended to be that way. Only below zero values kill you.

Also, in searching for my screenshot (which was not, say, in an obvious folder named 'screenshots' or such)

Screenshot saved in the "lib/user" directory as "dump-vB.txt".

I guess you're the lazy "don't read all that stuff" type?

Is there any possible way there could be an auto-explore option? The maps actually seem even bigger than Crawl's maps, and there is an option for such there... of course, Crawl has been around for a coon's age, so it probably wouldn't happen for a while, but can I at least get some hope? :/ Clearing the dungeons of foes and swag is kind of addicting...

In Crawl, the dungeon is static. So it's a little bothersome to go back and forth through the same place many times. In Sangband the dungeon is random, so it'd be pointless to have a auto-explore option because you'd end up moving five spaces and stoping in front of some monster, or worse, getting killed by an offscreen breath.


***

I've noticed that after making an screenshot (forum one) the visual prefs get reset. It's fine with me to make them default for the screenshot, but could the game restore my options after that? No. The load prefs doesn't help.
EDIT: Nevermind. Loading the [charactername].prf file fixed it.

[BDR]

Zero HP is intentional? That's a pretty uninituitive stance to take, and I've not seen that stance in any other games I've ever played that had HP values/life measurement in general. I mean, they're Health Points for crying out loud, and when you haven't got any health left, how can you not be dead? I suppose technically I should be grateful, but seriously, it doesn't follow logically to only die when you're in negative health, and not when you have no health at all left.

As for that text, I guess I simply passed it by. Finding myself only mostly dead when (after seeing the 0 HP) I'd expected to be all dead tends to distract a bit, and it's not like doing anything else will make it disappear off of the main screen and onto the smaller window, where I had no way to expect the notice saying where it went to go (seeing as that bit about where screenshots go when you take them isn't mentioned in the help files [yes, it's going to be different for all ports, and so and so forth, but as if you have other things you need to do, like getting more health before you die, missing the notice is easy to do; if there'd been something in the help files {which I am NOT too lazy to read} to give me an idea to keep my eyes peeled for more information on the screenshot after taking one, I wouldn't have missed it]). It'd be kind of like the low HP warnings, except once those start you can't use 5 anymore and have to use Enter to bypass the (+)'s, which IMO was a nice touch.

[Fuma]

I suppose technically I should be grateful, but seriously, it doesn't follow logically to only die when you're in negative health, and not when you have no health at all left.

Maybe you only live for one turn? I never walked around with 0 HP so I don't know. And if it is indeed only for one turn it's like you're *almost* dead, and using your last strength you can perform one action. That's a pretty logical explanation, if you ask me.

The files you create from within the game are almost always in the "usr" directory. This is true for all variants and Angband itself from what I recall.
I think that the directories were clearly described in the readme or help files of Zangband (first variant I played) so I never had a problem with finding files I wanted.

[Big Al]

HP is just a simplified way to give a integer label to how healthy you are. In some games you die when you reach zero, other when you reach -1. In some RPGs, you (permanently) die when your health reaches a certain negative number. It's basically arbitrary, and just takes a bit of getting used to.

I do like some of the ideas floating around though, about having a turn or two after 'death' to have that one last chance to quaff a potion or read a scroll of destruction.

[BDR]

I suppose I could understand it under that logic, but the way it actually works is that you can wander around just fine at 0 HP even if you don't heal right away. I used a wand of spark on some jackals, which got rid of them, and was able to walk a bit and even heal up back to full health. The "with my dying breath, I make one last choice" mechanic sounds neat, but outside of partial wins (slaying Morgoth but dying in the process) or heal saves I can't see that it has a lot of use.

Also: Can you give me some examples of games that let you walk around at 0 HP? I seriously can't think of any.

[camlost]

I do like some of the ideas floating around though, about having a turn or two after 'death' to have that one last chance to quaff a potion or read a scroll of destruction.

Unfortunately, I'd say that this is a really bad idea. Most characters would escape death most of the time, and the only real killers would be status ailments. No, you already one last chance to quaff a potion already, that's what the low hit point warning is for.

Also: Can you give me some examples of games that let you walk around at 0 HP? I seriously can't think of any.

D&D 3.0 and 3.5 allow you to take some actions at zero hitpoints, and you don't die until -10. It's all just semantics. In Angband you survive at 0 hp, that's just the way it works. It's pretty uncommon to land there anyhoo.

[K.I.L.E.R]

The Exile and Avernum series by Jeff Vogel have had 0 hp feature.
You hear a cough when you get brought down to 0 hp.

[ekolis]

I believe in Exile/Avernum you also can't die unless you start the turn at 0 HP (in other words, if you have 1 HP and get hit for 10000 HP, you don't die, you just go to 0 HP) - so it's essentially a "dying breath" feature. Or am I thinking of the rings in Sonic the Hedgehog? :P It's been so long since I played Exile...

[Arendil]

I believe in Exile/Avernum you also can't die unless you start the turn at 0 HP

This is not quite true. In Exile/Avernum if suffered damage is greater than remaining HP, you drop to 0 HP, even if you have 1 HP remaining and suffer 10k damage. At any time, while having 0 HP you can act normally, but next hit, even causing only 1 damage, means death. That obviously introduces some interesting group healing tactics......

[Bandobras]

I'm not sure if this is the right thread, but here it goes.

I run S on Debian/unstable linux, compiled with the default Makefile.sdl, run from the compilation directory (no make install). I play in 1600x1200, so I need to change the font to larger, but with some fonts (the bigger ones) I get the following error and the game exits:

X Error of failed request: BadValue (integer parameter out of range for operation)
Major opcode of failed request: 147 (MIT-SHM)
Minor opcode of failed request: 3 (X_ShmPutImage)
Value in failed request: 0x4c4
Serial number of failed request: 2549
Current serial number in output stream: 2588

Help!

[CJNyfalt]

I'm not sure if this is the right thread, but here it goes.

I run S on Debian/unstable linux, compiled with the default Makefile.sdl, run from the compilation directory (no make install). I play in 1600x1200, so I need to change the font to larger, but with some fonts (the bigger ones) I get the following error and the game exits:

X Error of failed request: BadValue (integer parameter out of range for operation)
Major opcode of failed request: 147 (MIT-SHM)
Minor opcode of failed request: 3 (X_ShmPutImage)
Value in failed request: 0x4c4
Serial number of failed request: 2549
Current serial number in output stream: 2588

Help!

Well, from the out of range error and that it's on the bigger fonts, my first guess would be that the needed screen size is bigger than your screen. Do you run in full-screen or in a window? Do you have the same problem in both?