Preparing for 4.2 release

[Ingwe Ingweron]

As far back as 2.5.1, I don't remember ever having it squelch artifacts.

[Pete Mack]

Ingwe--
You had to pick and choose the weapons you wanted to ignore. Alas, there is no reasonable way to do something similar for armor types, because even very low base AC armor (such as soft leather boots!) has excellent artifacts, even in standarts.

[fph]

I think Vanilla gets it about right in the balance between power and complexity. Tome's automatizer was extremely powerful, but it was also a mess to use.

[Ingwe Ingweron]

Yes, I just verified that is the case. It wasn't always so, however. You could ignore low-dice weapons when you got strong enough.

Are you talking about Vanilla? In all the years I've played this game, there's never been an ignore of artifacts, and when has there ever been an "ignore", or previously a "squelch", based on values in Vanilla? Maybe you're talking about a variant? Having an ignore based on values is something Fizzix tried to workout, if I recall, but never found a good implementation or interface, so the effort was shelved.

[Pete Mack]

Yes, I just verified that is the case. It wasn't always so, however. You could ignore low-dice weapons when you got strong enough.

As far as I'm aware, you can't ignore daggers - you can only ignore object kinds which appear somewhere in the main ignore menu (before the quality and ego menus).

[Nick]

you can't ignore artifacts. The highest level of ignore is everything except artifacts. (apart from an artifactless birth option, if I recall).

Yeah, I just noticed that too - which means I just fixed a bug that didn't exist. Will revert

[Ingwe Ingweron]

Nick-
Using the knowledge menu for ignore has *always* killed possible artifacts. (Ignore daggers, and you won't find any *thancs.) I am perplexed why torches deserve special treatment.

you can't ignore artifacts. The highest level of ignore is everything except artifacts. (apart from an artifactless birth option, if I recall).

[Nick]

Nick-
Using the knowledge menu for ignore has *always* killed possible artifacts. (Ignore daggers, and you won't find any *thancs.) I am perplexed why torches deserve special treatment.

As far as I'm aware, you can't ignore daggers - you can only ignore object kinds which appear somewhere in the main ignore menu (before the quality and ego menus).

[Pete Mack]

Nick-
Using the knowledge menu for ignore has *always* killed possible artifacts. (Ignore daggers, and you won't find any *thancs.) I am perplexed why torches deserve special treatment.

[Ingwe Ingweron]

This was a deliberate change, but maybe requires some more thought.

The issue is that now torches and lanterns can potentially be ego-items or (if you're playing with randarts) artifacts. So ignoring all torches was ignoring artifacts sometimes.

I guess the thing to do is to bring lights back into the "ignore by type" menu but put a special case in to avoid ignoring artifacts - does that sound correct?

You may need to have to separate ignoring menus, one for torches one for lanterns. I think you need to be able to ignore average torches without ignoring average lanterns. Then all should work the same as the other categories. No Ignore, Bad, Average, Good, Non-Artifact. As well as the Ego ignore by types of ego lights.

[Nick]

Another Ignoring Bug: I guess somewhere in the latest changes, a new ignoring bug was introduced. Ignoring a wooden torch, the only choices were: (a) this item only, or (b) all average lights. We lost ignore wooden torches. On purpose? I liked being able to ignore torches once @ had a lantern.

This was a deliberate change, but maybe requires some more thought.

The issue is that now torches and lanterns can potentially be ego-items or (if you're playing with randarts) artifacts. So ignoring all torches was ignoring artifacts sometimes.

I guess the thing to do is to bring lights back into the "ignore by type" menu but put a special case in to avoid ignoring artifacts - does that sound correct?

[Pete Mack]

I am impressed that this got broken. The knowledge menu should be robust to changes in types of object.

This doesn't work in master. It works on other things but not lights.

[wobbly]

Is there a specific reason not to allow ignoring objects that can have egos by tval? At some point a warrior has enough str/dex & a good enough weapon to be ignoring all the weapons below a certain base dice for instance.

[wobbly]

Surely this still works:
1. Open knowledge menu ('~a')
2. Scroll down to Lights
3. Open submenu with right-arrow or 6
4. Toggle squelch with 's'

Just verified in 4.1.3

This doesn't work in master. It works on other things but not lights.

[Pete Mack]

Surely this still works:
1. Open knowledge menu ('~a')
2. Scroll down to Lights
3. Open submenu with right-arrow or 6
4. Toggle squelch with 's'

Just verified in 4.1.3