A Few Questions/Observations From an Old Player

[Philip]

Speed, I guess. Higher speed means that you kill stuff faster, less chance of instadeath, monsters have fewer turns in which to notice you.

[Derakon]

For reference, every +3 stealth makes you about twice as stealthy. But every +10 speed also makes you twice as stealthy.

[Oramin]

For reference, every +3 stealth makes you about twice as stealthy. But every +10 speed also makes you twice as stealthy.

Good to know, but from a gameplay perspective, is there really that much difference between Excellent and Superb? As it is, it seems most things already let me walk up to them.

[Derakon]

It all depends on how long it takes you to get to a given monster, I suppose. If you're able to get to them before they wake up naturally, then you have enough stealth.

[Timo Pietilä]

Ok, another gear swapping issue. I'm already wearing Boots of Speed +10. I just found some Boots of Elvenkind +7 with +3 Stealth.

If I swap those in, I go from a typical speed of +19 to +16 but my H-T Warrior goes from Excellent Stealth to Superb. L49 hanging out at depth of L65.

Which is more important at this point: Stealth or Speed?

At those speeds, speed. +19 is almost at par with +20 monsters, which makes huge difference.

If your speeds were +29 and +26, then I would go with stealth.

[Oramin]

Thanks, folks. I decided to stick with my existing setup since it was working fine and I'm a Speed junkie. I'll worry more about Stealth when I finish (hopefully by winning) with this character and start work on a Halfling/Hobbit Rogue.

BTW, I only have a 72% chance to hit with my (now) L50 H-T Warrior wielding Eonwe and facing a Great Wyrm. Is this an effective cap? I mean can I get into the 80s or 90s?

[Derakon]

Assuming I'm reading the chance-to-hit logic correctly, your odds of landing a blow are given by

90 * (to-hit bonus - AC / 2)) / (to-hit bonus) + 5

In other words, if you're trying to hit a Great Storm Wyrm (AC 225), then we have:

90 * (x - 112.5) / x + 5 = 72
90 - 10125 / x + 5 = 72
10125 / x = -23
x = 440

giving an overall to-hit bonus of 440. Which seems...high. Anyway, increasing that bonus to, say, 600, would increase your chance to hit to 78% against the same target. So, not very much.

On the flip side, if your to-hit bonus was only 100, then you'd have a -6% chance to hit, if it weren't for the fact that you always get at least a 12% chance to hit.

[Oramin]

So, it sounds like Rings of Accuracy/Slaying are kind of pointless - unless they significantly increase the probability of crits?

[Derakon]

Well, part of the problem is the Great Storm Wyrm's stupendously huge AC. Compare against a Black Knight, which has an AC of 105. If your total to-hit bonus against him is 60, then your chance to hit is 16%; if you increase that to 80 then your chance becomes 36% (i.e. every +1 to-hit is about +1% chance to hit).

But yeah, at the point you're at now, to-hit bonuses don't mean as much. For melee anyway; I don't know the ranged combat formula and it may be different.

In v4, for what it's worth, everything has a base 75% chance-to-hit; only monster evasion affects this value (by decreasing it). Rings of Accuracy are instead Rings of Finesse, which give you slightly more blows per round -- compensating for a reduced hit chance by giving you more opportunities to hit.

[Oramin]

Are Wands of Annihilation useful for a H-T Warrior?

I only have a 51 Magic Device score. Wands of Annihilation have a device requirement of 60. So I have an 81.7% chance of success coming out to just over 200 points of damage per shot on average. Do I also get a damage reduction for such a low Magic Device score (like my Gnome Mage got a damage bonus for a high score)?

Compare with Belthronding being in the 250/round range (with Mithril and Seeker non-specialty arrows). Of course, this doesn't include the to-hit chance reduction or the possibility of crits.

[fizzix]

Are Wands of Annihilation useful for a H-T Warrior?

I only have a 51 Magic Device score. Wands of Annihilation have a device requirement of 60. So I have an 81.7% chance of success coming out to just over 200 points of damage per shot on average. Do I also get a damage reduction for such a low Magic Device score (like my Gnome Mage got a damage bonus for a high score)?

Compare with Belthronding being in the 250/round range (with Mithril and Seeker non-specialty arrows). Of course, this doesn't include the to-hit chance reduction or the possibility of crits.

There's never a damage reduction. I would say that Belthronding is better. Remember that's 250 average whereas annihilation is 200 max.

as for the original question. Rings of accuracy are useful for archery characters. But slaying is almost never worthwhile, I'd almost always rather have =damage for melee and =accuracy for archers.

[Derakon]

There's never a damage reduction. I would say that Belthronding is better. Remember that's 250 average whereas annihilation is 200 max.

Annihilation does flat damage; there's no random component. Also in my copy of the source it does 250, not 200, base damage (and the description of the item reflects this as well). Annihilation doesn't work against non-living opponents, though, so Belthrondig is more versatile.

I believe the damage estimates on the 'I'nspect screen take criticals into account.

[Oramin]

Just a warning to people about Scrolls of Satisfy Hunger. I read one before a battle with Ancalagon and had to drink some healing potions during the battle. This ended up putting me into a "Gorged" state and slowing me down by 10 points. I was at +34 before being "Gorged" so that wasn't a big issue but in close fights it could get you killed.

[Egavactip]

Just a warning to people about Scrolls of Satisfy Hunger. I read one before a battle with Ancalagon and had to drink some healing potions during the battle. This ended up putting me into a "Gorged" state and slowing me down by 10 points. I was at +34 before being "Gorged" so that wasn't a big issue but in close fights it could get you killed.

Yes, that happened to me during my battles with Sauron and Morgoth a couple of weeks ago. I don't think a healing potion should be able to give you indigestion.

[Timo Pietilä]

Just a warning to people about Scrolls of Satisfy Hunger. I read one before a battle with Ancalagon and had to drink some healing potions during the battle. This ended up putting me into a "Gorged" state and slowing me down by 10 points.

Second satisfy hunger removes gorged state.