New to the boards

[LostTemplar]

I have lost hope for angband ever being the game I loved again.

You have to start a variant, take old enough version and fix bugs/improve UI only. Many people here will like it.

[Magnate]

You have to start a variant, take old enough version and fix bugs/improve UI only. Many people here will like it.

But why would he do that when it's much easier and more fun just to slag off other people's work?

[Timo Pietilä]

You have to start a variant, take old enough version and fix bugs/improve UI only. Many people here will like it.

I wish I had time to do that. One good thing in current development is that you can tune a lot more without actually coding, so I might try to put something together using that one day. Unfortunately that "one day" seem to be too far away that I can see it.

[s-man]

Finished the game this morning and beat old Morgoth!

Now I was wondering has anybody ever gone through the whole game without dying? Seems impossible to me. Also has anyone ever found the "One Ring"? I was thinking since I beat it, I might try to look for it.

[nppangband]

Finished the game this morning and beat old Morgoth!

Now I was wondering has anybody ever gone through the whole game without dying? Seems impossible to me. Also has anyone ever found the "One Ring"? I was thinking since I beat it, I might try to look for it.

Congratulations!

Many people win without dying. It isn't too difficult if you are familiar enough with the monsters to avoid that fights that get you killed.

It is rare to find the one ring, but it happens. Many people, after winning, dive to level 127 and kill monsters until they find it. Sauron dropped it once for me.

[s-man]

Congratulations!

Many people win without dying. It isn't too difficult if you are familiar enough with the monsters to avoid that fights that get you killed.

It is rare to find the one ring, but it happens. Many people, after winning, dive to level 127 and kill monsters until they find it. Sauron dropped it once for me.

Is lvl 127 where its most prevalently found?

[debo]

I personally took my recent winner and scummed around trying to find Deathwreaker, which is easier to find than the One. Ran out of patience, though. After killing M, there didn't seem much point.

In general, finding a specific artifact on your wish list can take a looooong time. Look through some of the extremely-high-scoring ladder characters and read the comments and the turncounts. It's kinda scary

The problem I have is that after I finish a roguelike, I usually find it more interesting to play a _different_ roguelike than to finish the same one again w/ a different, more challenging race/class combination. Steamband looks really interesting to me, I might give that a shot.

Angband 3.3.x is probably my favorite roguelike ever so far, though. The fact that it's a bit easier than most helps a lot, I'm sure. Regardless of why, I found it to be super addictive. Thanks, devs

[nppangband]

Is lvl 127 where its most prevalently found?

It's just the deepest level in the dungeon, so based on how object generation works it is the level that you have the best chance of finding it. (Object generation was very recently changed in Angband, so this may no longer be the case. I am not sure)

[LostTemplar]

Now I was wondering has anybody ever gone through the whole game without dying?

You cant win with dying, it does not count. So everybody, who ever wins have done it without dying, very easy really, just dont let your @ die and win will happen after some time. Even ironman, unless it is egoless ironman, is not hard.

[buzzkill]

Steamband looks really interesting to me, I might give that a shot.

Steamband rocks. It can't be said enough, but it's not your typical rougelike. It's pretty brutal, and there's a little bit of learning to do, which probably involves browsing the help files, or at least reading the FAQ.

EDIT: I'd be remiss if I didn't include a link to my Steamband winner. One of (my) only two rouge-like wins ever.

[Goldbug]

You cant win with dying, it does not count. So everybody, who ever wins have done it without dying, very easy really, just dont let your @ die and win will happen after some time. Even ironman, unless it is egoless ironman, is not hard.

I think that calling Ironman "not hard" is a bit of a stretch.

But yeah, you can't call a game where you've died and reloaded a "win".

I'd go as far as to say that dying is the best part of the game. You can't appreciate the game fully if you save-scum. You don't get the full variety of the Angband experience. When you play many characters you have all sorts of different storylines. In one game you might find a wand of Annihilation early on that enables you to take out uniques. In another game you might find a really good bow on dlvl 5. Some people even find a Potion of Experience early on and find themselves at clvl 29 or so before they know it.

Save-scumming leads to grinding and inevitable boredom. Diving fast and accepting that most of the time it will end badly and you'll have to start a new character is the most enjoyable way to play Angband, IMHO.

/Former save-scummer
//Will never save-scum again, no matter how heartbreaking a death might be

[AnonymousHero]

I think that calling Ironman "not hard" is a bit of a stretch.

But yeah, you can't call a game where you've died and reloaded a "win".

I'd go as far as to say that dying is the best part of the game. You can't appreciate the game fully if you save-scum. You don't get the full variety of the Angband experience. When you play many characters you have all sorts of different storylines. In one game you might find a wand of Annihilation early on that enables you to take out uniques. In another game you might find a really good bow on dlvl 5. Some people even find a Potion of Experience early on and find themselves at clvl 29 or so before they know it.

Save-scumming leads to grinding and inevitable boredom. Diving fast and accepting that most of the time it will end badly and you'll have to start a new character is the most enjoyable way to play Angband, IMHO.

/Former save-scummer
//Will never save-scum again, no matter how heartbreaking a death might be

Indeed.

The fact that save-scumming requires you to do something outside the game should be enough of a tip-off that you're doing something that's not exactly legitimate.

Save-scummed(*) wins are simply not wins in any meaningful sense of the word. It kind of a sad indictment of the modern gamer mentality that this even has to be stated, but there it is.

(*) Or any other way of cheating death, unless explicitly included in the game rules. As an example of in-game "cheat death" rules, worshipping Eru in ToME 2.x will give you a reasonable chance (>66% IIRC) of cheating death if your piety is high enough at the point of death. Whether you do is completely up to luck (so don't rely on it!), but it's a coded rule.

[Derakon]

Okay, guys, you can lay off a bit. A savescummed win is still a notable accomplishment; it's not like savescumming removes all the challenge from the game. Sure, a savescummed win isn't a "real" win, but there's no need to insult the achievement.

[Therem Harth]

Okay, I feel I have to pitch in here...

I generally save-scum. I don't consider my (few) wins when doing so to be legit in any way; I don't post save-scummed characters on the ladder.

I don't save-scum because I feel pressured to win, and want to pass off a save-scummed win as legit. I save-scum because my characters get killed a lot, and restarting the game all the time gets boring fast.

Yes, I could stop save-scumming and become a better player. But I don't play Angband to become a better Angband player, I play it to have fun in my spare time. I really don't see the purpose of expending that much effort on something of no conceivable benefit to me.

All that said... If you claim a save-scummed win as legit, you are an idiot. But I don't consider save-scumming to be such a terrible thing in and of itself.

[buzzkill]

Okay, guys, you can lay off a bit. A savescummed win is still a notable accomplishment; it's not like savescumming removes all the challenge from the game. Sure, a savescummed win isn't a "real" win, but there's no need to insult the achievement.

Allow me. It doesn't remove all challenge from the game. It removes all challenge from winning. In short, a save-scummed win is inevitable.

In most, if not all, games where dying is allowed you receive a limited number of lives in which to accomplish your mission. Angband when played with save-scumming has no such restrictions.

If the limited lives restriction is not utilized, then usually in it's place is a weakening of the player character in some way as a penalty. Also, these type games tend to operate in real-time, not turn based.

In either of these scenarios a timer could also be utilized to increase difficulty.

In a turn-based game such as Angband, if you play with unlimited lives in an infinite dungeon, without any penalty for dying and no time limit, you will eventually win. It's inevitable.

Whether it's an accomplishment or not depends on the severity of the abuse which can't be quantified.

If you're playing for glory and bragging rights, you must not save scum.

Then again, if you're playing for fun do whatever you want, but posts to the ladder should state explicitly that save-scummed characters were in fact save-scummed. AAMOF, I'd go so far as to allow an indication in the ladder dump dialog that one could use to indicate a save-scummed or otherwise compromised character, and an ladder option (check box) to filter them out of displayed results.