Feet or Level ?

[Nick]

I'm sure someone else can though.

A ranga is a pace of about 38 inches; five thousand rangar is a lar, which is nearly three miles. Two rangar was called 'man-high'.

While I'm in UT and talking about measurements, consider the following:
"In later days, in the wars upon Middle-earth, it was the bows of the Numenoreans that were most greatly feared. 'The Men of the Sea', it was said, 'send before them a great cloud, as a rain turned to serpents, or a black hail tipped with steel'; and in those days the great cohorts of the King's Archers used bows made of hollow steel, with black-feathered arrows a full ell long from point to notch"

Given that an ell is 45 inches, and the length of draw of an English longbow is given by wikipedia as 32 inches, these were serious bows. Why has no-one implemented this awesome (Second Age ) weapon yet?

[thapper]

This is, IMO, true in general - Imperial units are far more convenient for everyday use, while Metric units are far more convenient for doing calculations with.

I'll buy that feet are a more "middle earthy" length unit (although, wouldn't different races feet be of different length and thereby messing up the whole system?) and I guess that pound is an as good weight unit as anything else for *bands (anything on that, Nick?), but when it comes to convenience for everyday use I dare say that it is *entirely* up to what you are used to. I'm with you on the calculations though

[PowerDiver]

Where did my copy of UT go? There's a section on Numenorean measurements. IIRC it's after "(The) Disaster of (or possibly at) Gladden Fields" One of the measurements is "man high" There was another for a pace. These would, I think, make excellent units of measurment for Angband, but I don't remember what they're called and can't find my copy right now. I'm sure someone else can though.

I vaguely remember a Bill Cosby skit that included "rods and cubits".

[ekolis]

Heh... and God said, "NOAH..."
And Noah said, "What?!"
And God said, "NOAH... I WANT YOU TO BUILD AN ARK..."
And then Noah said, "An 'ark'? What's an 'ark'?"
And God said, "IT'S A BOAT... I WANT YOU TO BUILD AN ARK 300 CUBITS LONG..."
And Noah said, "Oh, a boat, right, got it! Why didn't you say so in the first place... Now what's a 'cubit'?"


edit: P.S. what is "UT"? "Unearthed Tolkien"??? All I can think of is "Unreal Tournament", which doesn't sound right...

[Daniel Fishman]

UT = Unfinished Tales.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unfinished_Tales

[Atarlost]

Heh... and God said, "NOAH..."
And Noah said, "What?!"
And God said, "NOAH... I WANT YOU TO BUILD AN ARK..."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=so9o3_daDZw

Noah: "Right, what's an 'ark'?"
God: "...GET SOME WOOD. BUILD IT 300 CUBITS BY 40 CUBITS BY 80 CUBITS..."
Noah: "Right, what's a cubit?"
God: "LET'S SEE, I USED TO KNOW WHAT A CUBIT WAS..."


the "right" is very important since all the "right"s are the setup for the closing punchline, which the youtube video is missing for some reason. It should continue with

Noah: "How ya gonna do it?"
God: "I'M GOING TO MAKE IT RAIN FOR A THOUSAND DAYS AND DROWN THEM RIGHT OUT"
Noah: "Listen to this, you'll save water. Let it rain for forty days and forty nights and wait for the sewers to back up."
God: "RIGHT"

[The Sparrow]

Noah: RIIIIIGGGGHHHHT. Who is this, really?

and of course the last line from that whole bit

"You and me God, right?"

EDIT: Here is the full version http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n0KHt...eature=related

[Atarlost]

I've got it on cassette so I don't have the track breaks, but there are three Noah routines listed on the jacket:
Noah: Right
Noah: And The Neighbor
Noah: Me and You, Lord
I think it's pretty clear where they break up since Noah: ATN has a neighbor instead of God in it.

[Atarlost]

A ranga is a pace of about 38 inches; five thousand rangar is a lar, which is nearly three miles. Two rangar was called 'man-high'.

While I'm in UT and talking about measurements, consider the following:
"In later days, in the wars upon Middle-earth, it was the bows of the Numenoreans that were most greatly feared. 'The Men of the Sea', it was said, 'send before them a great cloud, as a rain turned to serpents, or a black hail tipped with steel'; and in those days the great cohorts of the King's Archers used bows made of hollow steel, with black-feathered arrows a full ell long from point to notch"

Given that an ell is 45 inches, and the length of draw of an English longbow is given by wikipedia as 32 inches, these were serious bows. Why has no-one implemented this awesome (Second Age ) weapon yet?

Those who know about them recognise they must have been enhanced in the telling. They are structurally impossible. The indicated structure is too rigid to give the indicated draw length with a bow that isn't too tall to use. If anyone was found capable of drawing it (probably an ent or maybe a troll) it would buckle. It may be possible to create a solid bow, but it would still probably snap. A steel bow would probably have to be flat, as a bow spring, or composed of stacked bow springs. See http://www.arbalest.com/definition.htm A man cannot draw an arbalest without mechanical assistance so it is probably impossible to draw one of Tolkein's steelbows as one would draw a longbow. A "sideways crossbow" configuration may be possible. A norbal crossbow can't have as great a draw length as a bow because the weapon would be too long to hold straight out but if held to the side as a bow the bowstring would intersect the archers chest. A sideways crossbow would be more difficult to load, but could, apart from the too rigid hollow structure, fit the description.

Also, archery is overpowered enough as it is. A base bow or crossbow type with an x6 multiplier would completely break the game. And that's if we assume heavy crossbows are arbalests. A Numenorean Steelbow is to an arbalest as a longbow is to a shortbow. If the heavy crossbow of Harad is an arbalest that would give the Numenorean Steelbow a multiplier of more like x9. Even at x6 any Steelbow of extra shots would compete with the best artifacts in the game. At x9 even a non-ego Steelbow would be competative for those with poor luck finding good ammo in adequate quantities. Might as well rename the game archerband.

[Nick]

Those who know about them recognise they must have been enhanced in the telling. They are structurally impossible. The indicated structure is too rigid to give the indicated draw length with a bow that isn't too tall to use. If anyone was found capable of drawing it (probably an ent or maybe a troll) it would buckle. It may be possible to create a solid bow, but it would still probably snap.

So, you're not aware of Numenorean steel, which was an iron/mithril alloy ... unbelievable (really) flexibility and tensile strength ...