reactions to changes in new V release

[nobody]

yay, super abundance of speed potions, sounds like fun

[Malak Darkhunter]

Sorry but no, just don't like the mouse, started playing the new version, and got confused pretty quick. It's really confusing in stores, and I believe hurts the careful gameplay of the player. So not for me. Is their however a way to turn this off and use the keyboard? I might try it if I can switch it off. For now I'll go back to the last version.

[zaimoni]

Sorry but no, just don't like the mouse, started playing the new version, and got confused pretty quick. It's really confusing in stores, and I believe hurts the careful gameplay of the player. So not for me. Is their however a way to turn this off and use the keyboard?

V: Yes, you can turn it off in Interface options.

[Orillian]

I was away from any new changes in Angband for a couple years! I just started playing the latest release and I must say the mouse options are not causing me to many issues! I have been using the mouse on and off and it has not really made a negative or a positive difference in the gameplay. some areas it's nice to have, others it doesn't even matter. I'd like to see a bit better cursor options and some highlighting changes so your a bit more aware of the state changes caused by using the mouse, but overall it's a nice start. especially towards making the game more accessible on systems like phones or the DS, etc.

O.

[Elsairon]

I'd like to see a bit better cursor options and some highlighting changes so your a bit more aware of the state changes caused by using the mouse, but overall it's a nice start.

O.

This sounds interesting, care to elaborate?

[Orillian]

Elsairon

This sounds interesting, care to elaborate?

As soon as you start using the mouse, in any program it's usually nice to see highlighting or state changes on mouse over and all that kind of thing.

One thing with the mouse in shops is that the price and weight are highlighted but not the name. adding highlighting to the name would be great, I'd prefer it to keeping the item name color coded in the inventory.

Another option could be right clicking for quantities. each right click is +1 to the item quantity. once right clicked a single left click would be a -1. Use a double left click to finalize the buy.

so for example I want 5 rations of food, so I go into general store, left click food rations. Item name is highlighted along with the weight and price, right click a couple times till the 1 in quantity goes to 5 , then double left click again to buy. that would be the quick and easy way...no need for a keyboard there. :P

Another mouse option would be right clicking on an entity/item to bring up a context menu of options available to you in relation to that item.

Example, right click a scroll and you get the options to pickup (walk over to it and pick it up. normal interrupt settings still apply.) or squelch.

Example of context menu options for creatures, right click and select throw or fire to shoot or throw an item at the creature. even give you the option to aim a wand or zap it if there is a wand or rod that can be used in your inventory.

Just some what if's regarding mouse usage.

O.

[Nick]

As soon as you start using the mouse, in any program it's usually nice to see highlighting or state changes on mouse over and all that kind of thing.

I've been probably most responsible for mouse over and right click features not being included. My reasoning is that most people with a regular computer (desktop or laptop) will probably mostly use the keyboard anyway. Mouse (or generally pointer) support is designed chiefly for use on mobile devices without a hardware keyboard, but with some kind f touch interface (PDAs, Nintendo DS, whatever). So everything is designed to work based on single clicks, and I think it should stay that way until we have the game completely playable (aside from the occasional bit of text entry) using the pointer. Then we can start adding features for players with an actual mouse.

Maybe the mouse interface will rival the keyboard some day, but IMHO we're not there yet.

[Orillian]

Nick, I can appreciate were your coming from.

now for my but...

The issue as I see it is this. People want mouse support, so it's there ,but only as a proof of concept really. You can use it to click on something to look at it, you can use it to select an item in the store, but then you have to basically go back to the keyboard. If Angband is in need of a mousing interface, be it for porting to systems without a keyboard, or for lazy people that just want to lean back and click their way through the game. It needs to be a proper mouse interface, as it sits it is fundamentally broken in that you can do part of an action with it, but you always have to go back to the keyboard to finish the actions you use the mouse for. There is no point at all having ANY mouse support in the game unless action sequences can be completed using the mouse.

I can understand why people are saying they don't like using the mouse, it simply does not speed anything up. in fact the back and forth between the keyboard and the mouse usually takes longer to do the action that does have partial mouse support simply because you have to switch focus to complete a task.

Click item in shop with mouse drop mouse go to keyboard and select quantity and then buy. Not at all efficient.

Now after all my complaining here I do also realize that the mouse support is a new addition to the program, and I can understand it being this way since it is so new to the game. I just hope all of you people that do the coding for the game realize the folly of only ever implementing a partially functional mouse interface.

Interfaces are the only area were Angband falls short. The game has archaic interfaces be it the user interface, mouse interface or the graphical interface. I've been playing the game since the very beginning so for me these shortcomings are not an issue but to expand the user base these thing do need addressing. As much as it makes the hardcore banders groan and cry out in pain, the continued existence of the Band's out on the rest of the internet are dependent on NEW players, and unfortunately to many of the potential new players are addicted to console games and the fluffy, simplistic interfaces those games provide.

Ok, I'm done ranting. Back to trying to pass 1200'.

O.

[Nick]

Ok, I'm done ranting.

And I pretty much agree with all of it. I think we have to live with it being implemented in stages. If you have a look at FAangband, you'll find that it's pretty much completely mouse playable. That is all eventually going to make it's way into Vanilla, but others are less keen on doing any old hack to the code to get the functionality working than I am

[calenth]

two things:

1) I find myself accidentally buying and selling things more often, which is a little annoying, and I miss the little l / g/ d/ s/ etc. menu at the bottom of each store. It might be harder for a new player to figure out the store interface in this version.

2) Where can I sell an Everburning Torch? The general store doesn't seem to accept it!

3) I do think that it's an improvement to not have lanterns in the general store.

4) Is the single cloak in the general store ever magical? In older versions the general store gave another place where you could potentially buy a good / ego cloak, now it appears to always be just a basic cloak.

On the whole I like the town changes. It seems like the stores keep the stuff I buy most frequently better stocked, which is much more convenient.

Is there a particular reason the cleric doesn't sell restore stat potions?

[zaimoni]

2) Where can I sell an Everburning Torch? The general store doesn't seem to accept it!

The Black Market buys anything. You'll get fiscally ripped off as usual, but compared to nothing that's fine.

4) Is the single cloak in the general store ever magical? In older versions the general store gave another place where you could potentially buy a good / ego cloak, now it appears to always be just a basic cloak.

No, no ego cloaks in the General Store in V3.0.9.

Is there a particular reason the cleric doesn't sell restore stat potions?

Not really (I don't think of tradition as a particular reason).

[calenth]

No, no ego cloaks in the General Store in V3.0.9.Not .

That's a shame. Shops should be randomized. Otherwise having that cloak just sitting there is a waste of visual space after the first ten turns of the game.

I guess it's quasi-comic. "So, yeah, I just killed Morgoth. You *still* trying to sell that same cloak?"

edit: question about squelch options. Is there a way to set it to squelch all cursed items *except* artifacts?

[Mondkalb]

I finally managed again to win with a dunadan paladin:

http://angband.oook.cz/ladder-show.php?id=7630

I had a hard starting time and much trouble to get basic needs, but later on the game went quite well.
I noticed some strange RNG behavior, though:
I couldn't find a single copy of "Wrath of God".

I also didn't get any boots of speed. Have they been removed? I only found one pair of boots of elvenkind with speed +1.

[takkaria]

I finally managed again to win with a dunadan paladin:

http://angband.oook.cz/ladder-show.php?id=7630

I had a hard starting time and much trouble to get basic needs, but later on the game went quite well.
I noticed some strange RNG behavior, though:
I couldn't find a single copy of "Wrath of God".

I also didn't get any boots of speed. Have they been removed? I only found one pair of boots of elvenkind with speed +1.

That's not strange RNG behaviour, it's normal random behaviour. And likewise with boots of speed. If they had been removed, you would have heard about it.

[Mondkalb]

Usually, WoG lies around on the floor on the fist levels, when you cannot cast the spells and need the money ...

I tried really hard and hunted Wyrms and such and also stumbled through some GVs, but with no effort.