Curses

[Magnate]

Well, it would be removable, if you're lucky. And the intention is that the better the item, the greater the dilemma for the player - do I try to remove the curse now, or wait until I have *RC*? (Or get better at it - what do people think about making removal chance dependent on player attributes?)

Hmm. That's going to vary by class then (unless you make it Charisma - ha, now there's a cross-reference to another thread!). I'm ambivalent - I can see arguments both ways.

I am also thinking of two types of aggravate. The first is like the current aggro on gear - everything nearby always wakes up. The second one will be mostly dormant, but occasionally everyone nearby (or maybe everyone on the level) wakes, and some monsters (in los, or nearby, or even randomly on the level, or some combination of these) are hasted.

Ooh yes - shriekavate! Nice. Make the first (always-on) one rare enough, and it should be fine. (You presumably already have negative stealth modifiers available to be generated, separate from curses?)

Yes, although I'm planning to do these by flags rather than values, so that would mean two or three levels of severity rather than a continuum.

Yes - I suspect two would be enough, but the more the merrier if you can be bothered to code them. So, what, something like 1 in 100, 1 in 50, 1 in 20? Though 1 in 20 is getting close to unplayable - so maybe 1 in 200/100/50 instead.

CC

[Arralen]

Curses, corruption and the dark side ...

Why not borrow the "corruption level" from ADOM in a slightly altered way?
- Every player/monster has a "corruption level" (how much he/it belongs to the dark side, is tainted by chaos etc.).
- Certain events, traps, usage of items increases the "corruption level". Weapons of Angband come to my mind here instantly , but lots of other things are thinkable ...
- "Corruption level"
a) is a negative modifier to light res.
b) is a positive modifier to dark res.
c) lowers the chance to detect/break curses on equipment (if this gets implemented, but's sounded pretty much like it would )
d) gives an increasing chance (at high levels) to cause mutations, maybe even a change in the chars race, thereby ending his career (new type of bone file?!). Chars with very strong personality (high charisma!) may become something powerful (Dark Knight, Uruk-Hai, Balrog ...) and -maybe- be able to go on for a little longer, while generally the char turns into some lowly impotent servant of Morgoth/Sauron (variants...) and "dies" in the process: "You succumbed to the lure of the dark side, following Morgoth/Sauron for the rest of your miserable life ..."

Maybe leave out the "background corruption" from ADOM .. hmm.. or maybe not, as it could serve as an incentive against turtling: Through the silent, hidden influence of Morgoth/Sauron the world gets corrupted, some nasty levels more then maybe Gondolin, though. "Background corruption level" is added to the actual dungeon level for rolling monsters & traps, but not for loot, for obvious reasons - now if it takes to long to take them down, you might not be able to any more ...

[Narvius]

c) lowers the chance to detect/break curses on equipment (if this gets implemented, but's sounded pretty much like it would )

And growing immunity to curses, also. Curses are bad for good people.

[Bodkin]

This sounds marvelous, and it would actually make it fun (in this humble player's opinion) to test things by trying them on. I would love it. A few thoughts, should you find them useful:

1) If failing to remove a stickiness curse makes an item strongly sticky, that might just make me seek death, because getting stuck with a bad weapon, for instance, could be the end of fun for that character. However, suppose there was an option, if this happened, to "absorb the curse" into oneself -- say, at the cost of a random attribute point, thus setting you free of the item? Decisions like this fascinate me, like the way rings now make you weigh their pluses and minuses.

2) What about a paralysis curse? Say, a 1/200 chance of paralyzing for 5-10 turns. This could be made especially nasty if you do it without notifying the player, because it would only become apparent if it happened around monsters.

[Narvius]

2 would need a notification. After all, you *do* realise if you can't move for several seconds. 1 sounds interesting.

[Nick]

The corruption thing is an interesting idea, but I'd need to think more about that - it's big change, and affects the whole feeling of the game.

1) If failing to remove a stickiness curse makes an item strongly sticky, that might just make me seek death, because getting stuck with a bad weapon, for instance, could be the end of fun for that character. However, suppose there was an option, if this happened, to "absorb the curse" into oneself -- say, at the cost of a random attribute point, thus setting you free of the item? Decisions like this fascinate me, like the way rings now make you weigh their pluses and minuses.

I think I prefer the blowing up idea upthread

2) What about a paralysis curse? Say, a 1/200 chance of paralyzing for 5-10 turns. This could be made especially nasty if you do it without notifying the player, because it would only become apparent if it happened around monsters.

This is an interesting one, and there are two possibilities:

1. Paralyse (probably only for 1-2 turns - any paralysis can be deadly) unless the player has free action or
2. Paralyse even if the player has free action.

In fact, I think I'll probably have both, and make it two different curses.

[takkaria]

I'll be watching FA's changes to curses closely with a view to Nicking them at a later time. I like what I see so far.

[Nick]

I'll be watching FA's changes to curses closely with a view to Nicking them at a later time. I like what I see so far.

You might want to read the reaction on rgra too - all the discussion has been very helpful. I'm in the early stages of implementing it all (well, I've allocated bit flags...) and have 23 different curses so far.

[Gen0cide]

Hello all, I'm new to the forums so bear with me if I make mistakes.

I do like the idea of multiple curse effects, but linking them to a players stats in combination with only giving the player the chance to try it once on each item seems a tad too much, because warriors and non-magical based characters will not only be the ones most affected by this change, they will also be the most likely to fall foul of it.

Maybe if you combine it with a town location that could undo the "major" curses, such as removing a sword permanently attached to you, but not uncursing it. That would add an escape from the loss of falling foul of something like this early in the game, and then not being able to use the better items your character gets as he grows.

[will_asher]

1) If failing to remove a stickiness curse makes an item strongly sticky, that might just make me seek death, because getting stuck with a bad weapon, for instance, could be the end of fun for that character. However, suppose there was an option, if this happened, to "absorb the curse" into oneself -- say, at the cost of a random attribute point, thus setting you free of the item? Decisions like this fascinate me, like the way rings now make you weigh their pluses and minuses.

I like this idea of trading something (like permanently lowering a stat) to remove a strong curse.

[Nick]

I do like the idea of multiple curse effects, but linking them to a players stats in combination with only giving the player the chance to try it once on each item seems a tad too much, because warriors and non-magical based characters will not only be the ones most affected by this change, they will also be the most likely to fall foul of it.

Yes, I think this is right - at least for scrolls/staves, which usually don't vary according to player attributes. I think making it depend on item attributes is probably the right thing to do, though. And for classes that get a curse removal spell, I'm not sure whether to have any variation of success (apart from normal spell failure).

One point to remember - the sticky curse is just one of many. Most items will not have it, so uncursing is less urgent.

The 'absorbing the curse' idea is an interesting one, but I think I'll get a basic implementation going first before using it (and that applies to some of the other ideas mentioned, too).

[Atarlost]

That sounds kind of like what the One Ring should do. Very hard to get rid of, unless it decides you're as useless to it as Isildur or Gollum, then keeping it is pretty much impossible.

[buzzkill]

On sticky or unbreakable curses. How about giving a fresh chance to remove curse once every x turns, where the number of turns is determined randomly based on the strength of the curse and is unknown to the player. Therefore, reading a stack of store bought remove curse won't do you any good, but reading a scroll every once in a while (as you find them), might prove effective, so there is always hope. Another option might be to make 'found' scrolls (of remove curse) slightly more effective than bought scrolls, though I don't know if I even like that last bit. Just thinking out loud.

[PowerDiver]

Here's a contrarian view. I do not think there should exist any spell similar to remove curse. Cursed objects have negative properties, such as random teleportaion, and you deal with them until you get rid of the object. Icky_wield should not exist, and icky_drop curses should only be on a rare set of artifacts, requiring some alternate method of dispersal, perhaps along the lines of killing a particular unique or monster type with them, or giving [via the throw command?] them to a particular unique or monster type who happily takes it from you.

[buzzkill]

... to make 'found' scrolls (of remove curse) slightly more effective than bought scrolls, though I don't know if I even like that last bit....

Having had some time to think this, it's an idea that I now like, a lot. Take the concept and spread it over all scrolls (and maybe potions too). Any such item found in the dungeon will be of the *dungeon* variety, replacing the current *ones*. These *dungeon* items will be roughly twice the power (either duration or efficacy) of their store bought counterparts, and will not be sold in stores, save the black market.