[Announce] Cthangband 6.3 Released

[Dean Anderson]

This is only a minor update - fixing a couple of bugs and tweaking the user-interface. Although since the user-interface is what you see when you play, it looks like qute a major change.

It's not. The gameplay changes in this version are minimal...

• Monster tracker now shows name of monster.
• Game time is now shown on main screen.
• Shops (and home) now have room for 26 items instead of 24.
• Backpack now has 26 slots instead of 23.
• Added wizard command to instantly win the game (rather anticlimactic, but useful for testing!)
• Fixed bug where using <Shift> to run didn't work.
• Graphical backgrounds added to game screens.
• Dungeon size tweaked to match new squarer display. The maximum size has gone from 198x66 to 198x123, and the minimum size has gone from 80x22 to 80x42. So that this doesn't produce a level with too many rooms, rooms have been spaced out more in the north-south direction by an amount proportional to the size change.
• Towns and wildernesses made smaller to fit new display.
• Display changed from 80x25 to 80x45 so that grid squares are actually square (on a standard 16:9 widescreen monitor).
• Event loop optimised, so game no longer uses 30%+ CPU while idle and waiting for a keypress.

You can get it from here.

[Aszazin]

It's nice, I'm currently testing the new version.

One remark so far: the parchment background makes the text on character creation difficult to read (or the colours used for the text are not ideal.)

Other than that, I died already several times, which is good! I like it hard. I'm very fond of the random character possibility.

The square font really feels Commodore-like. I like that a lot. The shift-run is working well too.
The use of background graphics also feels nice. I think it's the only angband-variant which does that. It opens perspecitives. In my opinion, gameplay is best in ascii, but backgrounds or images do not harm the ascii-fun in any way.

It would be nice if the space below the stats could be used for images of targeted monsters and objects in some way. These could possibly be gathered by calling on graphical artists to submit monster pix for the game. Don't know if there are a bunch of those pixel drawers here on the forum?

[Aszazin]

I'm having the selling problem again:
I have "21 rounded pebbles (1d2)" (unidentified)
I enter shop "1"
I push "s" to sell
I select the rounded pebbles (i) and it says "Selling 21 rounded pebbles (1d2) (i). -more-" -> "You quickly agree on the price. -more-" -> "Accept deal? [Y/n]""Final offer: 21"

I push "n", as I want to sell 1 rounded pebble.

The same happens when I try to sell a torch or a ration of food.
In shop "3" the same happens. I do not get the option to choose the amount I want to sell.

When I sell using "d"rop instead of "s"ell it actually does ask how much I want to sell.

[Dean Anderson]

It's nice, I'm currently testing the new version.

One remark so far: the parchment background makes the text on character creation difficult to read (or the colours used for the text are not ideal.)

Other than that, I died already several times, which is good! I like it hard. I'm very fond of the random character possibility.

The square font really feels Commodore-like. I like that a lot. The shift-run is working well too.

The font is actually just whatever font you've chosen in the Options screen, but stretched so that each character fits into a square cell. Theoretically you can use any font you have installed on your system, but I made the Options screen filter the fonts and only show the monospaced ones because proportional ones look really weird.

It did take me a while with different "parchment" textures and different colour schemes to come up with something that I thought was readable - and what I ended up with seemed like the best compromise in the end.

The use of background graphics also feels nice. I think it's the only angband-variant which does that. It opens perspecitives. In my opinion, gameplay is best in ascii, but backgrounds or images do not harm the ascii-fun in any way.

It would be nice if the space below the stats could be used for images of targeted monsters and objects in some way. These could possibly be gathered by calling on graphical artists to submit monster pix for the game. Don't know if there are a bunch of those pixel drawers here on the forum?

I did try putting a list of the visible monsters there, but there's simply not enough room. As it is, I need to split the name of the monster you're targetting onto three lines (and even then I sometimes need to truncate it or drop bits).

Having an image of the monster you're targeting sounds good in theory, but the problem is that there are around 575 monsters in the game so that's a lot of images that would be needed - and both quality control and copyright would be a thing. I'd rather have no images than poor quality images; and getting the right to use hundreds of good quality images drawn in a relatively consistent manner would be hideously expensive.

I'm having the selling problem again:
I have "21 rounded pebbles (1d2)" (unidentified)
I enter shop "1"
I push "s" to sell
I select the rounded pebbles (i) and it says "Selling 21 rounded pebbles (1d2) (i). -more-" -> "You quickly agree on the price. -more-" -> "Accept deal? [Y/n]""Final offer: 21"

I push "n", as I want to sell 1 rounded pebble.

The same happens when I try to sell a torch or a ration of food.
In shop "3" the same happens. I do not get the option to choose the amount I want to sell.

When I sell using "d"rop instead of "s"ell it actually does ask how much I want to sell.

I've still been completely unable to reproduce that. It's particularly weird that you say it works for 'd' but not for 's', since the two keypresses call the same function when pressed.

[Aszazin]

I've still been completely unable to reproduce that. It's particularly weird that you say it works for 'd' but not for 's', since the two keypresses call the same function when pressed.

Actually I was looking for my save game so I could send it to you some way, but I didn't find it. Actually it's good I cannot find my savegame, as it is opens the possibility of savegame cheating.

You are right about the monster images: better none than poor quality. It would be nice, but it should be created by a single artist or a small amount of artists. Just gathering images around the net will indeed result in a very poor quality and you'll get involved in copyright issues.

I think you'll need to use dark, not too saturated colours on the parchment: brown, black,darker shades of grey and such. Maybe limit the palette to one text colour, except where an emphasis is needed?
I must say it's not an easy background, especially because the game is based on a black background. Maybe something completely different, more dark in palette, could be more suitable? I'm not sure.

Most important is that the game is very enjoyable right now. The new font is a better size than before and feels good to me. I can run now.
You managed very well to implement a square font.

There is one thing on running that can be improved: running doesn't work when standing next to a wall. It should, run as long as there are walls in the same position around the players as when the run was initiated.
I think the other ~bands I play all do that, although I'm not sure. (I play/played Angband 4.2.0, ZAngband, Poschengband & Frogcomposband)

I miss a bit a repeat command (in the other bands this usually is "n"), but I consider this a small issue. It has the advantage that I tend to be more aware of what I'm actually doing, instead of multiple repeating and suddenly noting health has gone down severely.

[Dean Anderson]

There is one thing on running that can be improved: running doesn't work when standing next to a wall. It should, run as long as there are walls in the same position around the players as when the run was initiated.
I think the other ~bands I play all do that, although I'm not sure. (I play/played Angband 4.2.0, ZAngband, Poschengband & Frogcomposband)

I'm aware of that issue.

Cthangband's running used to do that too, but somewhere in the refactoring and port from C to C# it got lost.

[Aszazin]

I found another small issue: the lantern makes the walls yellow, but there isn't a difference between granite & magma when the wall is lit.

The selling error is totally consistent in my game. "s" doesn't let me choose how much I want to sell. "d" does let me choose.

Currently I'm playing a Miri Nigri Necromancer. My previous character was a Necromancer too and had the same, but it died today. Not sure if there is a difference between characters, but as I am not able to find a savegame to sent to you.
Is there anything else you need to know for the selling with "s"-bug?

[Aszazin]

A question: I'm used to have at least one staircase in both ways on every level. But with my current character I stumbled for a second time on 3-0 without a staircase down.

I'm wondering, is this by design?

Also, I was looking in the manual for the meaning of the level depth with 2 numbers. I suppose the first number is the depth? the second is always zero until now.

It was fun btw to go straight from 3-0 to 7-0 unexpectedly with my previous character (and then die by realizing too late I should start fighting with some more strategy involved!)

Also (edit): I chose a different font ( a bold one) and this fixed the difficulty to read on the parchment background completely, except for the light green on some %stats.

Is there a place where I can find more information about the race I'm playing?
I also have a deity mutating me, but I have no idea why and which one. (It is actually fun not to know where some things come from, but it doesn't lessen my curiosity. Btw, who knows what a deeper knowledge of the cosmos will do to me...?)
I just got an elephantine trunk (1d4) mutation. I cannot find it back in my fighting stats when I open the character sheet.

[Aszazin]

hmm... it's the third time I fully (at least: I believe fully) explored level 3-0 without finding a staircase down...
I'm level 11 now... I really want to go deeper...

[Aszazin]

https://imgur.com/a/9GdFo1O
Here's a screenshot of the 4th time I can't find any downstairs on level 3-0...

[Aszazin]

Because it feels like I got stuck, I started a 2nd game, but there is no shop "4" or "5" (so there is little chance I will obtain words of recall and other potions & scrolls.
(There are 3 black markets, in the other game, there wasn't a black market).

Is it meant like that?

[Aszazin]

I just encountered a crash. the game was gone. Opening the savegame threw me back at start level 1. I accidentally pushed a wrong button (s or d) in the dungeon after another command, but it all went so fast. It is difficult to say what exactly happened.

(sorry for the spray of reports, I really like Cthangband like it is now, and I happen to have some time for a long playing session today.)

[Aszazin]

I just found a possible imperfection. I just picked up a bronze rod, and used it to check what it does. It detects traps clearly, as it shows a Dtrap below and marks the area. But the rod wasn't recognized.
After identifying it is a rod of trap location, which I of course already expected.
Possibly this is by design? (don't know if there's also a rod which detects traps and more).

I never encountered this way of trap detection, where there is a visible indication of the detection and the (annoying) "you are about to leave a trap detected zone" followed by a "you just left a trap detected zone" which I know from other variants. It is the best system so far, in my opinion.

[Pete Mack]

Yes, it is common to many variants--a green border around the safe area, and a warning when you cross it. A few versions of V have it, from before the trap machanic was changed.

[Dean Anderson]

I found another small issue: the lantern makes the walls yellow, but there isn't a difference between granite & magma when the wall is lit.

True. That's basically due to there being a limited colour palette and not enough different shades of yellow to allow them to be distinguished from each other.

The selling error is totally consistent in my game. "s" doesn't let me choose how much I want to sell. "d" does let me choose.

I've (eventually!) found and fixed that. For the moment you will have to continue using 'd' to sell things, but in the next release 's' will work properly.[/QUOTE]

A question: I'm used to have at least one staircase in both ways on every level. But with my current character I stumbled for a second time on 3-0 without a staircase down.

I'm wondering, is this by design?

Because it feels like I got stuck, I started a 2nd game, but there is no shop "4" or "5" (so there is little chance I will obtain words of recall and other potions & scrolls.
(There are 3 black markets, in the other game, there wasn't a black market).

Is it meant like that?

The answer to these two is the same...

Cthangband doesn't just give you a single town and dungeon. Instead there is a whole island containing:

• 7 normal towns, with a "sewer" (like a small dungeon) under each one
• 1 special ruined town (Kadath) with a huge dungeon underneath
• 7 towers in the wilderness, of varying heights, where you go up levels instead of down and the levels are always very small
• 5 dungeons in the wilderness, of varying sizes

Each of those is randomly placed on the island when you start a new game, with roads connecting the towns; and of the 50 quests you need to do to complete the game, 25 of them are fixed with set uniques in set locations (at least one per tower or dungeon, and one each in two of the "sewers") and the other 25 are randomly generated and could be anywhere.

If you use the 'M' key to view the map while on the surface, you'll see the layout of the island with the towns identified and the dungeons and towers marked but not identified until you visit their locations to see what is there (you leave the town by walking out of one of the four gates in the walls.)

The 7 normal towns each have a different (but fixed) selection of shops in them based on the character of the town (from the source material - H. P. Lovecraft's Dreamlands), and you can start in any one of 6 of the 7 randomly. (The reason one of them is disallowed as a start location is that it doesn't have a "fair" set of shops, being only a small hamlet - although that is one of the two that always has a quest in its sewer.)

Most of the sewers are only 5 levels deep, since they're supposed to be "starter areas" and once you've outgrown them you move on to somewhere else. However, the exceptions are the two towns with quests in the sewers - which have 7 levels each and the quest monster on level 7; the town of Dylath Leen, which has 9 levels (that's also the one with three black markets that you encountered - it's the toughest location to start in); and the town of Celephais - which has a sewer that is only 3 levels deep.

So I'm guessing that you started in Celephais repeatedly and that's why your dungeon stopped at level 3.

As I mentioned, the game where you started in a town with three black markets is one where you started in Dylath Leen. Apart from the poor shop selection, the other reason that's the hardest town is that it has a difficulty of +1 rather than +0. Which brings me on to...

Also, I was looking in the manual for the meaning of the level depth with 2 numbers. I suppose the first number is the depth? the second is always zero until now.

The first number is the dungeon level you are on, which is always 1 for the first level below the surface (or above it in the case of towers), then 2, then 3, and so forth.

The second number is the difficulty of the dungeon level you are on. In most of the sewers under the towns this is +0, meaning that the dungeon level is basically what it says. In Dylath Leen (the town with multiple black markets - basically it's a hive of scum and villainy) it is +1. This mean that each level is one level harder (or deeper if you like) that its number would indicate. Effectively the first level has monsters (and treasure, and vaults, etc.) as if it were level two, and the second level has contrents as if it were level three, and so on.

All the external dungeons and towers outside the towns have a difficulty of at least +1, with the maximum being +50; so in that place simply going down the stairs to the first level effectively puts you on "level 51" of the dungeon.

Each dungeon/tower/sewer may also have a bias to a certain type of monster. For example in "The Kobold Fort" you're more likely to meet kobolds, and in "Shelob's Tower" you're more likely to meet spiders, etc.

The wilderness, by the way, has an effective level of 2 in places where there is no dungeon and has a bias towards animals. Where there is a dungeon or tower, the wilderness has a bias the same as that of the dungeon or tower and has a difficulty of half the difficulty of the difficulty or tower. So if you enter a wilderness area and struggle with the monsters there you know you're not hard enough to brave the actual dungeon or tower within.

The map of the island (seen by pressing 'M' while on the surface) shows the number of quests remaining in each location, the difficulty of the location, and the number of levels the location has. However, the latter two pieces of information are only shown once you have found them out. Basically, you need to enter the wilderness around the location to identify which location it is, enter the location itself to identify its difficulty, and get to its last level to identify how many levels it has.

However, the difficulty and number of levels can also be found on Scrolls of Rumour; as can details of the quests within them.

Is there a place where I can find more information about the race I'm playing?
I also have a deity mutating me, but I have no idea why and which one. (It is actually fun not to know where some things come from, but it doesn't lessen my curiosity. Btw, who knows what a deeper knowledge of the cosmos will do to me...?)

The information about the races is all displayed during character generation. I thought of putting in extra manual pages for the races but figured that would be thirty extra pages that contained nothing new over and above what's in the character generation screen.

If you're playing a Miri Nigri then you will naturally mutate when you go up a level. No specific deity is involved.

If you're playing a Fanatic or Cultist then you will have a specific patron assigned randomly at character generation (you'll see who it is before accepting the character, so you have chance to reroll it if you're unhappy with the one you got given), and your patron will (usually) give you a reward when you go up a level. This may be a mutation, but that's only one option among many.

If you're a Miri Nigri Fanatic or a Miri Nigri Cultist then you will get both a reward and a mutation when you increase in level. These characters are fun, but too random to be played seriously.

And if you're none of the above then you are very unlikely to get a mutation or a reward, but either (or both) is possible in the right - albeit rather rare - circumstances.

I just got an elephantine trunk (1d4) mutation. I cannot find it back in my fighting stats when I open the character sheet.

Mutations aren't included in your character sheet. Whatever damage they do (they only attack once per action regardless of how many attacks per action you normally get) is on top of what is displayed on your character sheet.

The main reason for that is that it would make the display too complicated and too long to fit on the sheet, especially if you have multiple mutations that use different dice.

I just found a possible imperfection. I just picked up a bronze rod, and used it to check what it does. It detects traps clearly, as it shows a Dtrap below and marks the area. But the rod wasn't recognized.
After identifying it is a rod of trap location, which I of course already expected.
Possibly this is by design? (don't know if there's also a rod which detects traps and more).

The rod is only identified if it successfully detects a trap.

Bear in mind that if you were already in a DTrap area then you wouldn't have noticed it do anything at all.

I never encountered this way of trap detection, where there is a visible indication of the detection and the (annoying) "you are about to leave a trap detected zone" followed by a "you just left a trap detected zone" which I know from other variants. It is the best system so far, in my opinion.

Cthangband doesn't have the annoying messages. It just turns the "DTrap" indicator yellow when you hit the edge of it (and stops you running at that edge).