couple things i've been thinking about ..

[Sky]

since Angband development is so active, i'll give my 2 cents. Seeing the game as an average player, that is.

1) once a potion / scroll / etc has been identified, use the same icon always.

just use an icon for "generic, non-identified potion/scroll/staff/etc" until the item is identified, then use the same in every game; so, i find a "potion", once i identify it as CCW, it will change into the azure potion icon.
This allows me, as a player, to use visual clues as to what is around me.
The randomness which prevents you from using an item before it's identified is not altered in any way but visually. Imho, positive tradeoff.

2) replace t and T default commands.

i maybe "take off" a dozen times in the whole game, but i tunnel through miles of stone.
Or, if the T command is seen as a safeguard, then have an interface option to switch the two.

3) expand the repeat command.

instead of just having ', i wouldn't mind to also have l ; ' (the two next to it) to repeat, with different functions:
' would repeat the last command - i.e. fire arrow (+1, +2) at orc
; would repeat fire arrow (+1, +2) and prompt for target
l would repeat fire and prompt for ammo.

the same would apply for spells, where the command is divided into 3 sub-categories, SPELLBOOK/SPELL/TARGET. Would still need to re-do command to change spellbook, but it's something.

4) have some sort of prebuilt macro options within the UI.

for example, a window where you can create macros to assign to the F1~F12 key, without needing to inscribe anything.
I really feel macros UI would improve the useability of the game for new players.


also, why not
5) can we make Enchant Weapon target more than one stack of arrows? If i have a stack of 6 arrows of acid (+4, +7) and a stack of 5 arrows (+3, +7) i need to find a Enchant Weapon To-Hit before i can use the *Enchant scroll.

6) what about changing the breakage rate on arrows based on their enchantment? When i find a stack of Arrows Of Wounding (+21, +23) i'd like to be able to use more than two before the whole lot is destroyed by a mob whose element i resist + temp resist.


i've started playing with a ranger, in case it wasn't obvious.

[fizzix]

since Angband development is so active, i'll give my 2 cents. Seeing the game as an average player, that is.

1) once a potion / scroll / etc has been identified, use the same icon always.

just use an icon for "generic, non-identified potion/scroll/staff/etc" until the item is identified, then use the same in every game; so, i find a "potion", once i identify it as CCW, it will change into the azure potion icon.
This allows me, as a player, to use visual clues as to what is around me.
The randomness which prevents you from using an item before it's identified is not altered in any way but visually. Imho, positive tradeoff.

2) replace t and T default commands.

i maybe "take off" a dozen times in the whole game, but i tunnel through miles of stone.
Or, if the T command is seen as a safeguard, then have an interface option to switch the two.

3) expand the repeat command.

instead of just having ', i wouldn't mind to also have l ; ' (the two next to it) to repeat, with different functions:
' would repeat the last command - i.e. fire arrow (+1, +2) at orc
; would repeat fire arrow (+1, +2) and prompt for target
l would repeat fire and prompt for ammo.

the same would apply for spells, where the command is divided into 3 sub-categories, SPELLBOOK/SPELL/TARGET. Would still need to re-do command to change spellbook, but it's something.

4) have some sort of prebuilt macro options within the UI.

for example, a window where you can create macros to assign to the F1~F12 key, without needing to inscribe anything.
I really feel macros UI would improve the useability of the game for new players.


also, why not
5) can we make Enchant Weapon target more than one stack of arrows? If i have a stack of 6 arrows of acid (+4, +7) and a stack of 5 arrows (+3, +7) i need to find a Enchant Weapon To-Hit before i can use the *Enchant scroll.

6) what about changing the breakage rate on arrows based on their enchantment? When i find a stack of Arrows Of Wounding (+21, +23) i'd like to be able to use more than two before the whole lot is destroyed by a mob whose element i resist + temp resist.


i've started playing with a ranger, in case it wasn't obvious.

1) This actually seems to be pretty difficult to implement, although I haven't played with it too much. Perhaps a better solution would be to do what DCSS does and overlay a smaller icon on the potions once they're identified.

2) This is very easy to implement but could break a bunch of player macros. Probably only should do it around a major release where many other things break as well.

3) My intuition is that this is nearly impossible to implement in a way that doesn't have weird unintended consequences.

4) The way the game should work is that you load your inscriptions from your previous game file. So you only need to do it once and then you always have your own custom macros and inscriptions. I don't think it would be bad to autoinscribe various books with useful inscriptions, perhaps a game option for that. (Autoinscribe books using current keyset yes/no)

5) Honestly, I'd rather see arrows not be enchantable at all...I certainly don't want them to be more powerful.

6) Mulching ammo is one of the very few things that reduces their extremely high value. Right now ranged combat is really the preferred way to take out many monsters. This is ok, but we'd like there to at least be some drawback. Mulching arrows and equipment destruction is one of the drawbacks.

[Derakon]

The 'n' command will repeat your last command, in case you weren't aware. Variations to repeat while prompting for various things could be interesting, if maybe a little ranged combat-centric.

[Sky]

i made a mistake, i meant n and not '. easy confusion since they are generally used with each other. the idea is still the same.

as for the icons, the game already has a "pile of coins" icon for any item which is out of LoS.

[t4nk]

1) once a potion / scroll / etc has been identified, use the same icon always.

just use an icon for "generic, non-identified potion/scroll/staff/etc" until the item is identified, then use the same in every game; so, i find a "potion", once i identify it as CCW, it will change into the azure potion icon.
This allows me, as a player, to use visual clues as to what is around me.
The randomness which prevents you from using an item before it's identified is not altered in any way but visually. Imho, positive tradeoff.

Good idea (btw, fizzix, that's not actually difficult).

2) replace t and T default commands.

i maybe "take off" a dozen times in the whole game, but i tunnel through miles of stone.
Or, if the T command is seen as a safeguard, then have an interface option to switch the two.

Just remove both; "take off" is accessible through 'e'quipment menu, tunneling is a bad thing anyway, and in any case you can use '+' command; you can also press Ctrl+direction into a wall to tunnel, you know?

3) expand the repeat command.

instead of just having ', i wouldn't mind to also have l ; ' (the two next to it) to repeat, with different functions:
' would repeat the last command - i.e. fire arrow (+1, +2) at orc
; would repeat fire arrow (+1, +2) and prompt for target
l would repeat fire and prompt for ammo.

Angband already has way too many commands!

4) have some sort of prebuilt macro options within the UI.

for example, a window where you can create macros to assign to the F1~F12 key, without needing to inscribe anything.
I really feel macros UI would improve the useability of the game for new players.

Not that difficult either... we just need to find someone who will agree to actually write the code
Also, Carthage must be destroyed, I mean, inventory shuffling must be stopped That would already make the game much less painful to new players.

5) can we make Enchant Weapon target more than one stack of arrows? If i have a stack of 6 arrows of acid (+4, +7) and a stack of 5 arrows (+3, +7) i need to find a Enchant Weapon To-Hit before i can use the *Enchant scroll.

Remove Enchant Weapon, like in 3.a.0

6) what about changing the breakage rate on arrows based on their enchantment? When i find a stack of Arrows Of Wounding (+21, +23) i'd like to be able to use more than two before the whole lot is destroyed by a mob whose element i resist + temp resist.

I think the idea is that you should avoid some mobs and not try to kill everything you see...

i've started playing with a ranger, in case it wasn't obvious.

Remove ranger, like in 3.a.0

[Pete Mack]

For potions, I agree it's a pain. For scrolls, it's already possible via modifying visuals then saving them. Mark always-want (mass banishment and the like) scrolls as pink, and usually-want (enchant weapon etch) as yellow. This works surprisingly well.

[Monkey Face]

tunneling is a bad thing anyway

How do you get into vaults without tunneling? Also, it's nice to be able to get past the pile of rubble between you and the stairs.

[PowerDiver]

How do you get into vaults without tunneling? Also, it's nice to be able to get past the pile of rubble between you and the stairs.

I've considered step-into-rubble autoclears the rubble in one turn, regardless of str or digging skill. I think it might too prone to being done by accident, which is the only reason I didn't put that into my mods. I did make all vault entrances rubble.

[t4nk]

How do you get into vaults without tunneling? Also, it's nice to be able to get past the pile of rubble between you and the stairs.

"I have to do it, so it must be good" - you are easy to please

[luneya]

How do you get into vaults without tunneling? Also, it's nice to be able to get past the pile of rubble between you and the stairs.

Usually with stone to mud. I guess if tunneling were removed, warriors would have to carry those wands. IIRC, priests don't currently get a version of that spell, but we'd surely give them one if we were serious about eliminating tunneling.

[Estie]

Usually with stone to mud. I guess if tunneling were removed, warriors would have to carry those wands. IIRC, priests don't currently get a version of that spell, but we'd surely give them one if we were serious about eliminating tunneling.

The idea here is to remove all tunneling abilities, including spells, the main purpose of that being to prevent the player from changing terrain advantageously for fights ("ASC").

[Ancient Green]

The idea here is to remove all tunneling abilities, including spells, the main purpose of that being to prevent the player from changing terrain advantageously for fights ("ASC").

The main reason why players feel the need to tunnel is to control monster summons because of the fact that being in view of multiple monsters means that the monsters can actions against the player character which include breathing ,casting spells and summoning more monsters. enough attack actions in a turn can bring a player character (half-troll warrior) from full hp to negative hp and instadeath is not a thing that is enjoyed in a game with permadeath. monsters bulky enough to summon a few monsters before dying do exist and the player character is required to fight two of them.

This means that the monster summoning needs to nerfed in some way before I support the removal of tunneling.

another result of removing tunneling is that the player has less money because of the inability to mine money ores. if that is a problem, it is easy fix it by increasing value of the other money drops.

[Estie]

The main reason why players feel the need to tunnel is to control monster summons because of the fact that being in view of multiple monsters means that the monsters can actions against the player character which include breathing ,casting spells and summoning more monsters. enough attack actions in a turn can bring a player character (half-troll warrior) from full hp to negative hp and instadeath is not a thing that is enjoyed in a game with permadeath. monsters bulky enough to summon a few monsters before dying do exist and the player character is required to fight two of them.

This means that the monster summoning needs to nerfed in some way before I support the removal of tunneling.

another result of removing tunneling is that the player has less money because of the inability to mine money ores. if that is a problem, it is easy fix it by increasing value of the other money drops.

Digging ASCs is by no means required to fight summoners - it just makes it slightly easier. If digging got removed, a more impactful side effect would be that GVs could be reached quicker (assuming that the entrance was always placed accessibly); this would be a huge advantage compared to having to deal with an awake vault from spending many turns digging in the vicinity.

Also, the way you argue against my quote, the impression is that you are contradicting me - in my last post I was trying to clarify a perceived misunderstanding, not stating my opinion. For the record, and whatever its worth, I am very strongly against removal of digging.

[Derakon]

I use ASCs to deal with any large group of enemies, e.g. maiar pits, many greater vaults, uniques and their escorts. The tactic isn't just for summons.