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That's fine, too.Comment
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It turns out this is an exaggeration - there are in fact 66 threads containing "rune-based". The first of these was started in late 2008, just under 7 years ago and before the release of Angband 3.1. Some of them make pretty interesting reading.
We have, in fact, been discussing the ID system and how it can be improved for longer than that. Many things have been suggested, but I think it's fair to say that we have reached a broad consensus that rune-based ID is at least worth a try.
So what is going to happen is that it will be implemented in an experimental feature branch and released for playtesting. It may turn out that everyone hates it and we throw away the whole idea, or that the basic idea works but it needs major surgery; it is almost certain to need at least considerable calibration.
In these circumstances, I am very glad to hear suggestions about how various aspects should work, but posting "we shouldn't do rune-based ID, we should do <idea X>" is not going to have any effect on the production of this experimental release.
I should also make it clear that I took on the maintainership with the clearly enunciated intention of not being afraid to change things, and that intention hasn't changed. Anyone not happy with that is free to play old versions, or start their own variant, or make their own version and claim it's the real Angband.One for the Dark Lord on his dark throne
In the Land of Mordor where the Shadows lie.Comment
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OK, I have just uploaded a mostly working version of the player knowledge branch - as in it failed to crash after 10-15 minutes of running around the town and dungeon - for which I would appreciate testing by those that feel like it. It is compiled for windows and OS X, or you can get a zip of the source.
A few points to note:- It is *not* savefile compatible with 4.0.x (but you can use your 4.0.x lore.txt file with it).
- The only intentionally visible changes are
- Dungeon features can change out of the player's LoS without the player seeing (doors open but apparently remain closed, walls apparently remain despite having been tunnelled away, etc) and
- Objects can be destroyed or picked up by monsters, and the player will not realise until they see the place the object was, or kill the monster and retrieve the object.
In particular, rune-based ID has *not* been implemented yet. I regard testing this as a favour to me rather than an exciting experiment for you. - There is a lot of underlying code change to achieve this modest outcome; consequently it is quite likely to crash, in which case sending me or posting a savefile would be appreciated.
One for the Dark Lord on his dark throne
In the Land of Mordor where the Shadows lie.Comment
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I haven't read the entire thread, so I may be redundant here, but... Dwarf Fortress remembers the last place you saw a monster and leaves it marked on the map(until you see the tile again and refresh it). Of course, Dwarf Fortress also provides information on sound, smell, and tracks, so if you start borrowing from it, you'll have quite a lot more work then you might have expected to do here.
Still, simply marking a monster's last known location is rather simple piece of the solution to the issue of separating a character's knowledge from reality.C(6.3) C Erirbag [Half-Ogre Cultist] L:39 DL:Collector's Cave 2 A+ R+ Sp w:The Long Sword of Karakal (2d5) (+9, +12) (+2)
C(TN/Do) W H- D-- c-- f PV s- d+ P++ M?
C S++ I+ So B- ac- GHB- SQ RQ V+ F:TomeNET Game ProgressionComment
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Let's try that again (and yes, that does mean recycling my previous post with the essentials edited).
There is a fairly thoroughly tested version of the player knowledge feature branch available. It is compiled for windows and OS X, or you can get a zip of the source.
A few points to note:- It is *not* savefile compatible with 4.0.x (but you can use your 4.0.x lore.txt file with it).
- The only intentionally visible changes are
- Dungeon features can change out of the player's LoS without the player seeing (doors open but apparently remain closed, walls apparently remain despite having been tunnelled away, etc) and
- Objects can be destroyed or picked up by monsters, and the player will not realise until they see the place the object was, or kill the monster and retrieve the object.
In particular, rune-based ID has *not* been implemented yet. - There is a lot of underlying code change to achieve this modest outcome; consequently it is quite likely to crash, in which case sending me or posting a savefile would be appreciated.
One for the Dark Lord on his dark throne
In the Land of Mordor where the Shadows lie.Comment
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One bug found so far. If @ has autoinscription set up, say for MB1, that includes a !k so that it can't be "ignored" and then ignores all other instances of MB1, every new MB1 that @ comes across is inscribed upon walking over it, so it is not ignored. I assume this bug was introduced with the work *not* done on rune-based id.
“We're more of the love, blood, and rhetoric school. Well, we can do you blood and love without the rhetoric, and we can do you blood and rhetoric without the love, and we can do you all three concurrent or consecutive. But we can't give you love and rhetoric without the blood. Blood is compulsory. They're all blood, you see.”
― Tom Stoppard, Rosencrantz and Guildenstern are DeadComment
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And now a replicable crash bug. Savefile is attached. @ is standing on the Dtrap line and has a Rod of Trap Location inscribed with @z2. Press z2, and game crashes. Blind_Bat.zip
Elsewhere on the level you will also see a magic book and prayer book reflecting the previously reported inscription/ignore bug. (Why does a Half-Troll warrior have an auto-inscription for magic books? I have a standard prf file that I load for all @. Nonetheless, if @ were a mage and didn't want to be bothered with new books already in inventory, the inscription/ignore bug would still apply.)
I love that "The only intentionally visible changes" all occur out of sight of @.
“We're more of the love, blood, and rhetoric school. Well, we can do you blood and love without the rhetoric, and we can do you blood and rhetoric without the love, and we can do you all three concurrent or consecutive. But we can't give you love and rhetoric without the blood. Blood is compulsory. They're all blood, you see.”
― Tom Stoppard, Rosencrantz and Guildenstern are DeadComment
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Thanks for the reminder - I had noticed some weirdness with autoinscription, but forgotten to chase it down.
Thank you. This has a moderate chance of happening with every attempt at Trap Location (more precisely, if the region contains an unsensed wearable item). In fact, it has highlighted a number of unsafe bits of code which I need to fix. I'll put an improved version out when I have it.
I'm pleased you made it to DL11 before getting a crash
Indeed. "The only visible change is that less changes are visible" might have been a better way of putting it
One for the Dark Lord on his dark throne
In the Land of Mordor where the Shadows lie.Comment
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And, of course, updating leads to the finding of new bugs. So here are the latest versions for Windows and OS X. Relevant bugs were crashing (sometimes) on dropping or ignoring a dungeon item in town, and crashing or corrupting the savefile on wielding an item from a stack (like a torch).
Must be getting close to bugfree now, surely
One for the Dark Lord on his dark throne
In the Land of Mordor where the Shadows lie.Comment
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You just had to tempt the Gods, didn't you? Have had repeated crashes in melee. Not specifically replicable, but if you melee the monsters right near @ now, there is a crash at some point, usually when the multi-hued dragon breaths fire. Blind_Bat.zip“We're more of the love, blood, and rhetoric school. Well, we can do you blood and love without the rhetoric, and we can do you blood and rhetoric without the love, and we can do you all three concurrent or consecutive. But we can't give you love and rhetoric without the blood. Blood is compulsory. They're all blood, you see.”
― Tom Stoppard, Rosencrantz and Guildenstern are DeadComment
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