Doors

[Mark]

It feels like Doors could have a greater impact on gameplay - but perhaps they already do and I don't appreciate it

• Closed doors break LOS from casters/breathers - good.
• Doors don't stop most dangerous monsters - they bash the door
• Secret doors don't have significance, they just slow you down. (in my experience)

Do other players strategically close doors? It makes no difference to stealth/waking monsters?

It's a shame there is nothing exciting or useful on the other side of a secret door (vs normal doors) - unlike virtually every story involving a 'secret door'. Perhaps we need a concept of secret passage or a secret room instead of just the door being secret - at least passages and rooms could contain something interesting (vs regular rooms/passages).

Has there been discussion around different grades of door that could stop greater monsters, Wooden Door, Iron Door, Mithril Door -if you're lucky enough to run away into a room with only mithril doors opening into it, you can close them and rest safe?

[Carnivean]

Doors are good at holding breeders. Worm masses, lice, flies in general can't bash doors.

Spikes used to strengthen doors I believe, but with the limitations of it never doing it when you need it.

Perhaps casters could have door buffs? Or create rubble pile/wall?

[Derakon]

Arcane casters get Create Doors later on, which can be surprisingly handy. But mostly I only ever close doors in the early game when there's a patch of breeders I can't kill and need to contain.

[Timo Pietilä]

Perhaps casters could have door buffs? Or create rubble pile/wall?

Create door as one door creation at target instead of all around you?

Wizard lock exists in almost all fantasy role playing games I know, so there should be one that makes door locked so that it can't be bashed. Maybe a timed- or range-limited effect. Working on already bashed doors also if possible. Blocking some entrances makes tactical choices that are not possible now.

[fizzix]

Create door as one door creation at target instead of all around you?

Wizard lock exists in almost all fantasy role playing games I know, so there should be one that makes door locked so that it can't be bashed. Maybe a timed- or range-limited effect. Working on already bashed doors also if possible. Blocking some entrances makes tactical choices that are not possible now.

Wizard lock has been on my radar for a while now. However, with the removal of spikes and door-jamming, I'm not sure the utility of the spell. If we ever allow players to place traps or have persistent damage spells like clouds of poison, then slowing a monster down for a few turns so it soaks up more damage is a fun tactical maneuver.

[Malak Darkhunter]

Wow, I discussed recently the benefits of doors and locking doors and it quickly gets shot down, as well as certain race/combos have better abilities at utilizing them and it quickly got shot down, and takkhira had plans on completely removing doors? Now you want to discuss the benefits of doors? and using wizard locks? I'm confused here guys. Perhaps you only listen to opinions of certain people on here? Just saying.

[AnonymousHero]

Wow, I discussed recently the benefits of doors and locking doors and it quickly gets shot down, as well as certain race/combos have better abilities at utilizing them and it quickly got shot down, and takkhira had plans on completely removing doors? Now you want to discuss the benefits of doors? and using wizard locks? I'm confused here guys. Perhaps you only listen to opinions of certain people on here? Just saying.

Well, people change their minds...

Anyhow, could you link to the thread? It might be of interest to the people participating.

[Malak Darkhunter]

http://angband.oook.cz/forum/showthread.php?t=6490&page=11

[Timo Pietilä]

Wow, I discussed recently the benefits of doors and locking doors and it quickly gets shot down

To me it looks like you are talking about opening locked doors, not locking open doors in the link you gave. Not quite same thing.

[Malak Darkhunter]

To me it looks like you are talking about opening locked doors, not locking open doors in the link you gave. Not quite same thing.

Oh no...you guys thought doors where an aggravating gsme play mechanic, should probably just be removed, remember?

I hope you don't wizard lock your "hollywood" cardboard door, that won't stop anybody

[Timo Pietilä]

Oh no...you guys thought doors where an aggravating gsme play mechanic, should probably just be removed, remember?

I never said anything like that.

I hope you don't wizard lock your "hollywood" cardboard door, that won't stop anybody

Unless the spell protects the door itself. "This door is made of paper. Why can't I get thru it?".

[Malak Darkhunter]

No you didnt say that exactly, you just felt like you needed to throw a joke in there though...

So let me get this straight....locked doors are pointless????? But the ability to lock doors are useful now all of a sudden??????? Really?????

[Timo Pietilä]

No you didnt say that exactly, you just felt like you needed to throw a joke in there though...

So let me get this straight....locked doors are pointless????? But the ability to lock doors are useful now all of a sudden??????? Really?????

Locked doors in perspective of player are pointless, because you can bash or dig thru. Locked doors in perspective of monsters are equally pointless because monsters that are some danger are usually capable of bashing thru the door, and those that are not just closing the door is enough.

In short, doors as they are now are useless, except as blocking LoS, because they can be bashed thru. Also because bashing is single turn action for monsters.

So what I'm proposing is character level based wizard lock that prevents any kind of opening the door even if monster would usually be capable of bashing thru the door. Like you would be physically at the other side of the door blocking it. That done from distance, not like spiking it.

Other improvement I would suggest is door levels. Permanent doors that protect vaults that are impervious to bashing. Locked or not locked. If locked would require either spell to unlock or lock picking.

Also, stone-to-mud should not be quite as powerful as it is now: maybe require multiple shots to make a hole. Something like granite-quartz-magma-rubble-open. It's still a lot faster than digging unless you happen to be dwarf with excellent digging tool.

[Malak Darkhunter]

That was kind of exactly my point Timo, permanent doors for vaults harder doors to open is more interesting in my opionion...now why didnt anybody agree to that then?

[Nick]

Wow, I discussed recently the benefits of doors and locking doors and it quickly gets shot down, as well as certain race/combos have better abilities at utilizing them and it quickly got shot down, and takkhira had plans on completely removing doors? Now you want to discuss the benefits of doors? and using wizard locks? I'm confused here guys. Perhaps you only listen to opinions of certain people on here? Just saying.

I think the problem here is that you are expecting the forum to behave like one consistent human, when in fact it is a bunch of different people on different days, with different initial stimuli (HallucinationMushroom, I'm looking at you) and probably having forgotten what they said yesterday. Also, if you're looking at the pros and cons of some feature, even relatively sane people (I mention no names this time) are quite capable of arguing one thing one day and another thing another day.

For example, my initial reaction to this thread was "Doors? Really? They're fine, I have other things to think about." Having read the thread a bit, I'm starting to think about possibilities. This is the benefit of discussion.

Also I suspect everyone was a bit feisty that day because buzzkill had stirred them up. Group dynamics are such fun