Amused by the thought of other types of mimics...

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  • krazyhades
    Swordsman
    • Jun 2013
    • 428

    Amused by the thought of other types of mimics...

    "That Huan, Wolfhound of the Valar was really a monster!"
  • Patashu
    Knight
    • Jan 2008
    • 528

    #2
    There's a Dungeon Crawl: Stone Soup vault that goes on the floor of the dungeon and displays a shiny Orb of Zot (think nethack amulet of yendor) and four runes behind glass. (They're all mimics.)
    My Chiptune music, made in Famitracker: http://soundcloud.com/patashu

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    • ekolis
      Knight
      • Apr 2007
      • 921

      #3
      Originally posted by krazyhades
      "That Huan, Wolfhound of the Valar was really a monster!"
      Mimics that mimic monsters? But *why*?
      You read the scroll labeled NOBIMUS UPSCOTI...
      You are surrounded by a stasis field!
      The tengu tries to teleport, but fails!

      Comment

      • fizzix
        Prophet
        • Aug 2009
        • 3025

        #4
        I think the monster you're looking for is a shapeshifter or a doppelganger. Something that could mimic another monster. The question is whether it should just appear like it outwardly, or whether it should have some of its powers.

        Comment

        • Derakon
          Prophet
          • Dec 2009
          • 9022

          #5
          I've long wanted for hallucination to spawn phantom monsters that couldn't hurt you but would only vanish when both a) you stopped hallucinating, and b) when you tried to damage them (we can assume they just never would try to cast spells, and all of their melee attacks mysteriously miss). Combine that with the game not actually telling you when you weren't hallucinating any more; it'd just stop spawning phantoms. But the existing ones would stick around until "disproved".

          As an added bonus, they should appear by being cloned from existing monsters, so you wouldn't be able to tell which one is the real one.

          Comment

          • Nick
            Vanilla maintainer
            • Apr 2007
            • 9647

            #6
            Originally posted by fizzix
            I think the monster you're looking for is a shapeshifter or a doppelganger. Something that could mimic another monster. The question is whether it should just appear like it outwardly, or whether it should have some of its powers.
            FAangband has this. Shapechanged monsters get all the powers of the new shape, but retain things like HP. They change back after a few turns, or when you kill them.
            One for the Dark Lord on his dark throne
            In the Land of Mordor where the Shadows lie.

            Comment

            • Timo Pietilä
              Prophet
              • Apr 2007
              • 4096

              #7
              Originally posted by ekolis
              Mimics that mimic monsters? But *why*?
              Huan is no monster. It's intelligent dog. Those cuddly not-so-little hairball-things that youtube is full of.

              Huan is almost as bad as Radagast as monster. Or Farmer Maggot.

              Comment

              • half
                Knight
                • Jan 2009
                • 910

                #8
                Originally posted by Derakon
                I've long wanted for hallucination to spawn phantom monsters that couldn't hurt you but would only vanish when both a) you stopped hallucinating, and b) when you tried to damage them (we can assume they just never would try to cast spells, and all of their melee attacks mysteriously miss). Combine that with the game not actually telling you when you weren't hallucinating any more; it'd just stop spawning phantoms. But the existing ones would stick around until "disproved".

                As an added bonus, they should appear by being cloned from existing monsters, so you wouldn't be able to tell which one is the real one.
                This is an excellent idea and not actually all that hard to implement. Sil takes a different approach: each monster is generated with the r_idx of the monster it will appear as when you are hallucinating (all monsters in a group change to the same new monster), so you see interesting consistent hallucinations with creatures (and items) swapped around. I think your approach is at least as good and one could also do both.

                Comment

                • taptap
                  Knight
                  • Jan 2013
                  • 710

                  #9
                  Originally posted by Timo Pietilä
                  Huan is no monster. It's intelligent dog. Those cuddly not-so-little hairball-things that youtube is full of.

                  Huan is almost as bad as Radagast as monster. Or Farmer Maggot.
                  Indeed. Apparently the player is not trying to rid the world of evil, but to claim the throne of Morgoth for himself. That is one of the things that just feels wrong in Angband (not that I got very deep in the dungeon, but I already killed plenty of good guys in the early floors).

                  Comment

                  • buzzkill
                    Prophet
                    • May 2008
                    • 2939

                    #10
                    IIRC DaJ has illusiory monsters that appear, among other times, while hallucinating. They appear identical to their normal counterparts, but in actuality have nerfed HP and attacks (plus there are resists that make them non-issues as well as magical means to dispell). In compenstaion, and to put a good scare into the player, they sometime spawn OoD which also means that they can still be quite dangerous. A nerfed mature red dragon doesn't sound like a player killer... unless your on DL10.
                    www.mediafire.com/buzzkill - Get your 32x32 tiles here. UT32 now compatible Ironband and Quickband 9/6/2012.
                    My banding life on Buzzkill's ladder.

                    Comment

                    • Monkey Face
                      Adept
                      • Feb 2009
                      • 244

                      #11
                      Originally posted by taptap
                      Indeed. Apparently the player is not trying to rid the world of evil, but to claim the throne of Morgoth for himself. That is one of the things that just feels wrong in Angband (not that I got very deep in the dungeon, but I already killed plenty of good guys in the early floors).
                      Well, except for Farmer Maggot and some of the townspeople, all of the others are trying to kill you or make it easier for others to kill you. So it's hard to really call them good guys.

                      Comment

                      • Derakon
                        Prophet
                        • Dec 2009
                        • 9022

                        #12
                        Originally posted by Monkey Face
                        Well, except for Farmer Maggot and some of the townspeople, all of the others are trying to kill you or make it easier for others to kill you. So it's hard to really call them good guys.
                        The ones that are really problematic are the maiar, ainu, and uniques like Huan and, uh, Fundin Bluecloak I guess. What's Huan's beef with me? Worried I'll kill Carcharoth before he can?

                        Comment

                        • fizzix
                          Prophet
                          • Aug 2009
                          • 3025

                          #13
                          Originally posted by Derakon
                          The ones that are really problematic are the maiar, ainu, and uniques like Huan and, uh, Fundin Bluecloak I guess. What's Huan's beef with me? Worried I'll kill Carcharoth before he can?
                          We could probably argue them all away with appropriate flavortext. "Even Huan, the once mighty wolfhound of the Valar, has fallen sway to Morgoth's charms..."

                          Comment

                          • ekolis
                            Knight
                            • Apr 2007
                            • 921

                            #14
                            Originally posted by fizzix
                            Morgoth's charms
                            What, did Morgoth find a +999 amulet of charisma?
                            You read the scroll labeled NOBIMUS UPSCOTI...
                            You are surrounded by a stasis field!
                            The tengu tries to teleport, but fails!

                            Comment

                            • klassik
                              Apprentice
                              • Sep 2013
                              • 89

                              #15
                              Originally posted by ekolis
                              What, did Morgoth find a +999 amulet of charisma?
                              no, it was bribery

                              amulet not evil enough for morgy
                              He did the mash.
                              He did the morgoth mash.
                              The morgoth mash.
                              It was an angband smash.

                              Comment

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