Modded object file rarities for many items - anyone else want to test?

[PowerDiver]

Maybe this is just me but I feel I've been, ahem, burned by that tactic enough times that I don't do it. I can see it in an ironman game but in a standard game I usually have a stack of things at home so losing one is frustrating but no big deal. Then there is the "if it will destroy it, use it" philosophy.

I did say "some people". I would have said "I don't" two days ago, except I just did it one day ago to take out a black dragon pit the old fashioned way with a warrior, but I had rNexus kind of mooting that example.

[nullfame]

I've just found that I run in to problems hiding stuff aside from just nexus. Something crushing my stuff. Something looting it. Too dangerous pack of monsters finding it or generated guarding it. Situation getting out of hand elsewhere in the dungeon forcing me to teleport level. At this point in my career the risk/reward ratio isn't there, unless it is something heavy I am just carrying to sell. More accomplished players have different calculus.

Taking out a pit I can imagine stowing acid-vulnerable items around the corner in the moat but not too far away. Even then I don't know. That's most of your best escapes if not your recall (I prefer scroll over rod). If something I can't handle shows up there could be real trouble.

Regarding nexus hounds showing up before stat gain, I guess that's what makes them so scary!

[ewert]

Okay bit off topic, but just returned from a 6000km motorcycle trip to check out Mont Blanc and the Alps (WICKED!!!, and I've seen lots of what natura has to offer, first time really enjoyed just the views ) ... soooo, I'm back to finishing up my testing of the item allocation changes.

Char dump

http://angband.oook.cz/ladder-show.php?id=10472

For those interested in current consumables/stuff and so forth. I had some unlucky experience with some electric stuff prior I left so lost a few rods of treasure detect etc.

[ewert]

Okay got careless with Sauron at 550hp, and got manastormed, yey.

Anyways. Clearing a pit of multihueds at dlvl99 was insane (had L/F/C immunities ). Lots of great drops, finally a couple of rods of detection too. I didn't get that much a chance to test the >95 lvl drops though.

As squelch takes care of stuff you don't need/want, and you only see what you need want, I think this object.txt file works okay. It DID take me to dlvl99 to find rods of detection, awgh, heh. That had to be RNG though. I think game ended around 600k turns getting careless. Missiles are plentiful enough with good/great drop stuff, that I might even think of lowering the amounts of them too, but the other stuff are dropping fairly good even now so I don't see the point really. I think I will try maybe a priest now, and see how the offensive wands/rods works with these drop rates (should be more plentiful).

All in all, it's kinda working IMHO.

[nullfame]

All in all, it's kinda working IMHO.

Do you have a dump? It is hard to independently evaluate your Sauron kit otherwise.

How many of these things did you have before facing him: 3 healings, ?banish, ?massBanish, ?destruction. How many did you use beforehand? Judging from your dl78 dump you were more than prepared with all of the above and drowning in ?teleLevel, not to mention maxed in all but INT and 18/66 ain't bad. I can't think of a time I was packing 5 !enlightenment. A _destruction would have been helpful but I assume you found that.

Off topic, why do you hoard ?protEvil. Isn't that junk or am I reading this wrong?:

Protects you from evil for 1d25+level*3 turns: all melee attacks by evil monsters have a chance of 50 in (your character level + 1d100) to be repelled, unless the monster's level is higher than your character level.

My reading is anything above dl50 isn't affected. My character level is always smaller than my dungeon level.

[Timo Pietilä]

Off topic, why do you hoard ?protEvil. Isn't that junk or am I reading this wrong?:

My reading is anything above dl50 isn't affected. My character level is always smaller than my dungeon level.

That's not dlvl, but mlvl. Most monsters are native shallower than 2500' with exception of deep (new) demons, undead, wyrms and uniques. ProtEvil works against giant pit very well (with exception of Titans). It is not as useful as it used to be, because JLE moved quite a few monsters deeper rendering prot from evil useless against them (but making danger jump at 2500' much less dramatic) including those titans.

[nullfame]

I thought mlvl was their native depth? So most of the time your current threats (things in depth) aren't impacted. You are certainly right about giant pits though. I never thought about saving some for that, though in that case I would carrying them and dropping when I needed a slot.

[ewert]

Do you have a dump? It is hard to independently evaluate your Sauron kit otherwise.

How many of these things did you have before facing him: 3 healings, ?banish, ?massBanish, ?destruction. How many did you use beforehand? Judging from your dl78 dump you were more than prepared with all of the above and drowning in ?teleLevel, not to mention maxed in all but INT and 18/66 ain't bad. I can't think of a time I was packing 5 !enlightenment. A _destruction would have been helpful but I assume you found that.

Lets just say I went lighthearted into fighting Sauron. Overall I had the consumables, I think I actually squelched _destr at some point. Definitely an issue of me usually farming insane gear that I went so lightheartedly into fighting him though. Carelessness kills as usual.

Off topic, why do you hoard ?protEvil. Isn't that junk or am I reading this wrong?:

My reading is anything above dl50 isn't affected. My character level is always smaller than my dungeon level.

Actually, it has been so long when I last checked prot from evil exact formula ... =P Good to know it is not so useful when deeeeep, I guess it is mostly a hangover for me from midgames that I tend to keep it around.

[ewert]

Updated the ladder to the death dump:

http://angband.oook.cz/ladder-show.php?id=10472

Yeah I went a bit lightly equipped. I like more the leveling and gearing up part of the game anyways than the last two fights, so no worries.

[nullfame]

Interesting. Yeah, it looks like he was damaging you pretty good and you used a !healing when maybe something more potent would have been in order. Thems the breaks

[Timo Pietilä]

I thought mlvl was their native depth? So most of the time your current threats (things in depth) aren't impacted.

mlvl is the native depth. Deep monsters are not impacted, but it is nice to fight big pack of demons (for example) and not get hit at all (Lesser Balrog is dlvl 49 monster). Vrocks are a good use of prot. from evil (they hit hard) and something like Dreads can't hit you often. So it is useful, just not against the really big ones.

You are certainly right about giant pits though. I never thought about saving some for that, though in that case I would carrying them and dropping when I needed a slot.

I don't think they are worth a inventory slot though. Useful as spell, less useful from external source.

[ewert]

Okay finished my priest

http://angband.oook.cz/ladder-show.php?id=10485

A fun experience, stuff plentiful enough, might even tune down a notch but of course with clairvoyance, erhm, well it's easier to find em. =P I liked it a lot.

[d_m]

I just wanted to say that I have been playing with this patch for a bit and thought it worked really well.

I honestly didn't notice a *huge* change but I do think that interesting consumables and items show up a bit more... I felt like I was recalling to town less and was using more scrolls "as they came". Unless I notice something crazy or hear a good objection I will probably commit your changes sometime soon so they'll get wider testing.

Thanks for working on this!

[ewert]

There is a few slight tunes that I feel like are in order, but in general yeah I like how it works.

One very important change IMHO was that I made potions of restore mana available earlier. Full casters are "the schnitz" now, and in my experience the most noticeable problem area was lack of mana at the near-stat-gain levels against uniques. A potion of rMana would enable to take on a unique earlier, which makes casters as casters more interesting and different in playstyle, again, in my experience.

[d_m]

There is a few slight tunes that I feel like are in order, but in general yeah I like how it works.

One very important change IMHO was that I made potions of restore mana available earlier. Full casters are "the schnitz" now, and in my experience the most noticeable problem area was lack of mana at the near-stat-gain levels against uniques. A potion of rMana would enable to take on a unique earlier, which makes casters as casters more interesting and different in playstyle, again, in my experience.

Especially if you're going to be working on this more, could you provide a patch against an SVN revision instead of a new file. Magnate has been doing work in object.txt and I don't want to clobber that.

If you can't do that it's fine, but it would help get it into SVN faster.