Tried my hand at a basic player's guide.

[Pete Mack]

I wrote it to help absolute newbies break the bad habit of scumming dl's 1-3. It doesn't consider gameplay past dl 20. It gives a rundown of the basic survival strategies for a fighter class, and a discussion of a reasonably conservative start that reduces the usual frustrations of early play.

Comments are very welcome.

http://rephial.org/wiki/PlayersGuide

EDIT:
I vaguely recall something like this by Eddie, but I can't find it.

[d_m]

Pete,

This guide seems like a good start. Some things I might add:

1. Testing new scroll/potion flavors on a down staircase.
2. An actual description of throwing oil for damage, since a lot of people might not know about (v) to throw.
3. I might encourage people to bring more than 2 phase door scrolls, to make it easier to get to dlevel 10 or deeper without running out. I often try to get at least 6.
4. You might want to mention ID-by-use since it makes finding good weapons in the dungeon a lot easier.

Also there's a typo where "uou" is used instead of "you"

[Pete Mack]

Pete,

This guide seems like a good start. Some things I might add:

1. Testing new scroll/potion flavors on a down staircase.
2. An actual description of throwing oil for damage, since a lot of people might not know about (v) to throw.
3. I might encourage people to bring more than 2 phase door scrolls, to make it easier to get to dlevel 10 or deeper without running out. I often try to get at least 6.
4. You might want to mention ID-by-use since it makes finding good weapons in the dungeon a lot easier.

I'm thinking about this kind of thing, but I was trying to keep it as general as possible, to avoid information overload. I think tips like this need to be in a different chapter. (And in fact they are already in the user's guide

Good point about about the oil, however.
Fixed

Also there's a typo where "uou" is used instead of "you"

Fixed

PS: what's the origin of throwing weapons? In many variants, 'THROWING' and 'WELL_BALANCED' do double and quadruple damage. Was this ever true in V?

[Derakon]

I think balanced throwing weapons first showed up in either O or S. Don't quote me on that though. To my knowledge throwing weapons have never been in Vanilla.

[Pete Mack]

d_m, thanks for the feedback.

I added some additional discussion of missile weapons and flasks of oil, as suggested. It goes well with the emphasis on player power rather than details about how to ID stuff on the floor.

[Magnate]

I wrote it to help absolute newbies break the bad habit of scumming dl's 1-3. It doesn't consider gameplay past dl 20. It gives a rundown of the basic survival strategies for a fighter class, and a discussion of a reasonably conservative start that reduces the usual frustrations of early play.

Comments are very welcome.

http://rephial.org/wiki/PlayersGuide

EDIT:
I vaguely recall something like this by Eddie, but I can't find it.

IMO it's a shame that you created something totally separate from http://rephial.org/wiki/UserManual, instead of adding to or editing it to achieve the same result. IMO the existence of two separate items (albeit with slightly different but overlapping aims) will do more harm than good.

[Pete Mack]

IMO it's a shame that you created something totally separate from http://rephial.org/wiki/UserManual, instead of adding to or editing it to achieve the same result. IMO the existence of two separate items (albeit with slightly different but overlapping aims) will do more harm than good.

I thought the aims were different enough to separate the two. I'll be happy to move it, if you point me at where it fits in the other document. (I didn't see a convenient place.)

[fizzix]

It seems like your guide is aimed at the player that has played a couple of times but doesn't get past dlevel 5-10 very often. However, I think it skips the most important question. "How do I avoid xxx monster?" I.E. you say to avoid water hounds, but how do you do that? Answering that question will certainly add longevity to @'s life.


I am working on a much more detailed description of how to play for an absolute newbie. Once the new release version is finalized and I can include whatever updates it has, I'll post it here.

[Pete Mack]

It seems like your guide is aimed at the player that has played a couple of times but doesn't get past dlevel 5-10 very often.

This is my definition of a newbie... Reaching level 5 or 10 is easy on an occaisional basis is easy. Reaching stat gain with reasonable reliability should be the first goal for a newbie.


However, I think it skips the most important question. "How do I avoid xxx monster?" I.E. you say to avoid water hounds, but how do you do that? Answering that question will certainly add longevity to @'s life.

That's tactics. And if you actively think about avoiding them, you will. (Teleportaion, closing doors in hallways so they fall behind, running for the stairs, etc.) So long as you are not trying to fight them, you will do well enough.

Also, I don't think there's any one recipe for a newbie. Too many details loses the reader in the weeds.
an outline of bullet points is probably enough.

I am working on a much more detailed description of how to play for an absolute newbie. Once the new release version is finalized and I can include whatever updates it has, I'll post it here.

I suspect most of the basic gameplay is already fixed in the next release. I'm not sold on what I've seen of 3.1.2 anyway--I suspect that standard artifacts have become simply too powerful. (Dal-i-Thalion with +5 speed added, and still most of the same late-game resists as Soulkeeper??)

[Nick]

I like it. Good job.

[Pete Mack]

I like it. Good job.

Thanks Nick. Any editorial suggestions?
It's really only good to dl 20 or so, when tactics start being more important, but I figure that you're pretty much on your own at that point.

[Nick]

Any editorial suggestions?

Not really - I haven't played a lot of recent V, and can't see any standout problems with it. I'll leave the nitpicking to those who know what they're talking about

[PowerDiver]

http://rephial.org/wiki/PlayersGuide

I got only as far as putting hp at 3b before deciding we are very far apart. I would put rule #1 that you need

your hp * his max moves per your move > his max attack

Later, you should note that another way launchers are overpowered is that extra shot launchers allow you to achieve that inequality even when your speed is much less than his, which cannot be achieved with any other attack method.

[Derakon]

Given that the next version of V is apparently going to shift to fractional blows, weapons of extra attacks are going to be accomplishing the same thing.

Frankly I think that the shift to fractional blows is going to cause a lot of balance problems, even though I support it happening.

Anyway, from what I read of your guide, it's a very calculating, "follow these rules and you will succeed" type of thing. And while there's not necessarily anything wrong with that, I don't think it's particularly newbie-friendly; beginners should be being encouraged to figure out how the game works, and can figure out how to succeed at the game as they go along. They're focusing on how to fight kobolds and novice warriors, not how to dive to 500' ASAP. So I wouldn't characterize this as a guide for newbies.

[Hariolor]

Anyway, from what I read of your guide, it's a very calculating, "follow these rules and you will succeed" type of thing. And while there's not necessarily anything wrong with that, I don't think it's particularly newbie-friendly; beginners should be being encouraged to figure out how the game works, and can figure out how to succeed at the game as they go along. They're focusing on how to fight kobolds and novice warriors, not how to dive to 500' ASAP. So I wouldn't characterize this as a guide for newbies.

Seconded. OTOH, based on my own experience, I spent a lot of time getting very frustrated before I finally sucked it up and took the advice to dive, dive, dive. I learned a lot more in a very short period of time, so much so that I now spend very little time on the lower levels, even with very weak characters. I think encouraging this 'breakthrough' for new players to happen sooner rather than later is a good idea. However, there is some amount of time that is necessarily going to be spent dying from spiked pits, hunger, rooms full of lice, etc.

I'd be afraid telling a new player "don't ever bother fighting those" will make them wonder why they're in the game at all. Figuring out what to fight and avoid is part of the experience. This issue may resolve itself somewhat if/when the challenge/level gradient in the dungeon is reworked.