Emergency fix for stat potion scarcity?

[Donald Jonker]

Dear Sir -

It's becoming clear from dumps on the ladder and the competition that the stat pot situation is dire. I'm somewhat concerned that with stat potions being so rare, the game may be unwinnable, or at least excessively difficult. Since 3.1.1 is set for release in March, I wonder whether this state of affairs (and the current competition) may warrant an emergency release to fix it. Is this problem something that can be fixed in a relatively short amount of time? I'm confident that this is something everyone will agree needs fixing prior to anything else. As always your work - past, present, and future - is deeply appreciated.

Your Humble Servant,

D. Jonker

[Nick]

One big reason for having a 3.1.0 comp straight away was to find bugs - which seems to have worked out quite well. I think it would be better just to let it stand, and give 3.1.0 as is have a good workout.

[PowerDiver]

It's a competition! Extra difficulty will separate the adventurers from the miners.

Says the guy who, playing 3.1 but not the comp, hasn't been able to survive to 1500'.

[RogerN]

Are we sure that stat potions are overly scarce? In my few attempts at diving past 1500' in the current competition, I've found at least three stat potions. And that was probably in fewer than 2000 player turns at those depths.

[Zikke]

I'm down around dlvl 55-60 on my warrior and the stat potions are still a bit scarce but not disturbingly so. I personally like it because it is novel when you find one and maybe "getting to 30 and maxing stats" won't be so given for every game, like "go to the General Store and buy a lantern" used to be.

[Donald Jonker]

Are we sure that stat potions are overly scarce? In my few attempts at diving past 1500' in the current competition, I've found at least three stat potions. And that was probably in fewer than 2000 player turns at those depths.

I've played three characters past 2000' in 3.1, and have gotten 2 or 3 stat pots total, all from uniques before 1500'. Maybe I've just been insanely unlucky, but I'm getting kind of discouraged to the point of wanting to wait for the next version so my current promising char has a shot. It is indeed fun despite the difficulty. I was thinking maybe I'd be verbalizing a common sentiment, but if folks want to let it ride, I don't want to rain on any parades.

[takkaria]

Dear Sir -

It's becoming clear from dumps on the ladder and the competition that the stat pot situation is dire. I'm somewhat concerned that with stat potions being so rare, the game may be unwinnable, or at least excessively difficult. Since 3.1.1 is set for release in March, I wonder whether this state of affairs (and the current competition) may warrant an emergency release to fix it. Is this problem something that can be fixed in a relatively short amount of time? I'm confident that this is something everyone will agree needs fixing prior to anything else. As always your work - past, present, and future - is deeply appreciated.

There has been at least one winner in the game so far, so it's not unwinnable, but it does seem stat potions are substantially rarer. I also don't have the spare cycles at the moment to push out another release with bugfixes, so it's going to have to wait at least til February. However, if people who aren't playing the comp want to tweak the A: values of the stat potions in lib/edit/object.txt to make them a bit more common and feed back what better values would be, they should feel free.

[TJS]

I like the new scarcity of stat potions. It stops all later characters looking the same and means you don't have to hang around looking for them for ages. I guess at the moment it means high-elves are even more overpowered though.

Perhaps you could add some better equipment bonuses to compensate? My suggestion would be adding more launchers, gloves and boots that add stat bonuses (bows of strength etc.).

[Donald Jonker]

However, if people who aren't playing the comp want to tweak the A: values of the stat potions in lib/edit/object.txt to make them a bit more common and feed back what better values would be, they should feel free.

I'm willing to give this a go - trying to make sense of the numbers... currently the A value is set to 80 for stat pots. Will making it higher or lower make them more common? Any particular value you'd recommend?

[takkaria]

I'm willing to give this a go - trying to make sense of the numbers... currently the A value is set to 80 for stat pots. Will making it higher or lower make them more common? Any particular value you'd recommend?

Lines take the form A:x:y to z
Making 'x' bigger makes it more common, making it smaller makes it less so. 'y' is the first level it can occur on (not including OOD drops) and z the last. 100 might work, I'd try that for a while first.

[Donald Jonker]

Lines take the form A:x:y to z
Making 'x' bigger makes it more common, making it smaller makes it less so. 'y' is the first level it can occur on (not including OOD drops) and z the last. 100 might work, I'd try that for a while first.

Sounds good - I'll give feedback after I run a few chars under the new settings. Thanks for the help!

[chem]

There has been at least one winner in the game so far, so it's not unwinnable, but it does seem stat potions are substantially rarer. I also don't have the spare cycles at the moment to push out another release with bugfixes, so it's going to have to wait at least til February. However, if people who aren't playing the comp want to tweak the A: values of the stat potions in lib/edit/object.txt to make them a bit more common and feed back what better values would be, they should feel free.

I'm guessing most people in the comp are trying a powerdiving technique in order to win in fewest turns. I think changing [V] to better help diving is not necessarily a good thing. If they weren't playing fewest turns, we may receive different balance comments.

[Donald Jonker]

I'm guessing most people in the comp are trying a powerdiving technique in order to win in fewest turns. I think changing [V] to better help diving is not necessarily a good thing.

Sounds like sour grapes to me. Not asking for anything to be easier, just to not be unreasonably more difficult than before.

If they weren't playing fewest turns, we may receive different balance comments.

I haven't changed my habits and have noticed a marked difference. If you're getting the same results from slow play in 310 as in 309, that'd be pretty interesting, but I doubt that's the case. In any event, I think changing the rarity in the edit file per Andrew's instructions may have fixed things.

[Nick]

It's becoming clear from dumps on the ladder and the competition that the stat pot situation is dire.

I think this just became obsolete...

[Donald Jonker]

I think this just became obsolete...

Yeah I just noticed it myself. Foot-in-mouth disease is a terrible, terrible illness. But all the same, I'm not sure I'll be switching my rarity back down to 80 just yet.