Bug in nightlies

[Timo Pietilä]

Hello.

I'm no longer able to pick up or drop items in my home while in home. Every command seems to come in delay, so that I pick them up only after I leave home. That is more than annoying.

[Timo Pietilä]

Hello.

I'm no longer able to pick up or drop items in my home while in home. Every command seems to come in delay, so that I pick them up only after I leave home. That is more than annoying.

OK, this is unplayable. Does anybody know which version has shops working properly and how to get it?

[Ycombinator]

r2041 definitely doesn't have this bug.

[ewert]

I haven't touched the ones after menu refactoring started, I think r2041 is the one yep.

[Timo Pietilä]

I haven't touched the ones after menu refactoring started, I think r2041 is the one yep.

Thanks to both of you. That one works fine. If you could you should add a warning about this bug in http://rephial.org/nightlies/ relevant version.

[Timo Pietilä]

Thanks to both of you. That one works fine. If you could you should add a warning about this bug in http://rephial.org/nightlies/ relevant version.

Noticed that monster color scheme had been reversed back to that very confusing "Ancalagon the Violet, Ar-Pharazon the Violet, Lesser Balrog the Nalfeshnee-impersonator" -scheme. I thought I had already fixed that.

How do I get that fixed color scheme in official release?

[Timo Pietilä]

Thanks to both of you. That one works fine. If you could you should add a warning about this bug in http://rephial.org/nightlies/ relevant version.

Noticed pretty soon after starting the game that I get good and excellent feelings for no apparent reason. I think it might have something to do with rods of curing even that they are useless. Spend a lot of unnecessary time trying to find what caused those feelings.

Current dungeon generation is broken. It produces way too many boring levels. My best level this far has been one that was "looks like any other level" (got boring level and dived immediately). It had *acquirement* and acquirement and three uniques.

I want autoscum back. Playing current vanilla tends to be boring. Too few vaults, pits and interesting rooms. Not enough floor items.

There is also something wrong with generation of rods of detect doors and stairs. Have found only one and I'm at 2550' feet currently.

Currently best item finding place is Black Market. Way better than dungeon. More items, better quality. Which is wrong.

[ewert]

Regarding autoscum, I wasnt playing (actively, have played pre and post of course =P) when it was removed so don't know why it was removed, but I myself have been of the mind that autoscum was awesomesauce ever since have not had it as an option ...

[fizzix]

Current dungeon generation is broken. It produces way too many boring levels. My best level this far has been one that was "looks like any other level" (got boring level and dived immediately). It had *acquirement* and acquirement and three uniques.

What do you think the solution should be?

IMO one solution should be that OoD or artifacts should contribute about 10 times as much to level feelings as they currently do. OoD monsters in pits should not contribute at all, rather the pit should have a specific value. Jelly pits are not interesting, and should not be treated as interesting in any case. Uniques should count as monsters 1.5 * Level. Acq scrolls should count as a 5 level OoD object on every level. Artifacts should count as objects 2x their min level. All these numbers are guesses.

In the later levels of the dungeon, the only things that should be contributing to level feelings are vaults, artifacts, acq, dragon/demon/undead pits, high Uniques.

A second solution would be to raise the drop rates (and variability) of rods,staves and wands. Keep potions, rings, amulets and weapons the same. Make most scrolls drop in stacks (excepting banish, mass banish, rune, acq and *acq*). If you find a stack of 10 ?dispel undead scrolls, maybe they'd actually be useful.

Finding an OoD rod, staff or wand should be a lot more common. I -fire bolts on dlevel 10 should produce a superb feeling and somethign like that should happen once every 10 or so times on that level.

[Derakon]

Fizzix: it's not so much that the level feelings aren't useful as that the game isn't trying to generate interesting levels currently. One way to solve this would be to bring back the autoscummer; probably a more elegant way would be to simply ensure that boring levels aren't generated in the first place.

[Timo Pietilä]

Fizzix: it's not so much that the level feelings aren't useful as that the game isn't trying to generate interesting levels currently. One way to solve this would be to bring back the autoscummer; probably a more elegant way would be to simply ensure that boring levels aren't generated in the first place.

Exactly. Maybe increase in floor item generation in general. My last char was priest which had unlimited access to Clairvoyance and it wasn't rare case that I got a level at 4900' with only four items. Four. At that deep there should be near guaranteed lesser vault at the level. Greater vaults should not be as rare as they are now. IIRC I found only one in entire game, and I wasn't making record time (basically just killing time playing Angband).

[Derakon]

Of course, it's entirely possible that there were more items on the floor that got squelched. Still, that implies that there were at most four equipment items generated on the floor (assuming you weren't squelching entire classes of equipment, which seems unlikely), which still seems low.

[fizzix]

Fizzix: it's not so much that the level feelings aren't useful as that the game isn't trying to generate interesting levels currently. One way to solve this would be to bring back the autoscummer

What the game currently thinks is interesting often isn't interesting. This is directly tied to the level feelings, in turn directly tied to autosummer.

probably a more elegant way would be to simply ensure that boring levels aren't generated in the first place.

Yup, that's kind of what I'm getting at. Fixing the level feelings is necessary in order to have an automatic "autoscummer."

I agree with Timo that GV frequencies need to go up. You should find one about every 5-10 levels at dlevel 90+. After that, levels become more interesting by adding more OoD monsters and items. Beyond that, you need to start making a larger range of special rooms, like the moated rooms.

[Derakon]

I'll agree that fixed level feelings are needed to have a functional autoscummer. However, my point was that a functional autoscummer is not needed to generate interesting levels. In fact, the autoscummer always was a rather ugly hack around the problem of the dungeon generator making boring levels. Any time your algorithm involves "Try N times and pick the best result" you're looking at an opportunity to be more elegant.

[PowerDiver]

One simple change would be to modify the room placement algorithm so that if a more interesting room is attempted to be placed, and the space is occupied by a less interesting room, then remove the less and place the more. I don't remember the conditions for the room placement phase to terminate, so there might need to be another change so that it doesn't just iterate until all rooms are vaults.

As to the dearth of floor items, that is yet another annoying consequence of the attack on TMJ. It used to be that you'd get their replacement from random kills of weak creatures, but with the recent change in drop level the combined changes mean that you have exchanged DL90 items for DL50 or DL60 items. It think it is much harder now to find a stat ring +6 than it used to be in 3.0, but I might just be imagining that.