A varient with more traditional save options?

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  • sethosayher
    Rookie
    • Jan 2008
    • 5

    A varient with more traditional save options?

    I know that deleting save files for characters that die is intrinsic to the value and the philosophy of all roguelikes. However, I'm wondering if any variants offer the chance to play the game with a more traditional save structure, that won't delete your character for every death?

    I know some people will vehemently protest to this request but...I don't know what else to tell you guys. I just feel I'd personally derive more enjoyment with a more traditional save scheme...if one exists.
    Last edited by sethosayher; May 21, 2009, 18:49.
  • Donald Jonker
    Knight
    • Jun 2008
    • 593

    #2
    I don't think there are any *bands which support this, but I vaguely recall reading about a game on r.g.r.misc that does, so you may want to investigate there.

    That said, save scumming isn't particularly difficult. Just make a copy of your save file whenever you deem it reasonable. No one's gonna bother crucifying you unless you attempt to debate the relative merits of doing so.
    Bands, / Those funny little plans / That never work quite right.
    -Mercury Rev

    Comment

    • petebull
      Apprentice
      • May 2007
      • 51

      #3
      No, because there is an option 'Allow player to avoid death' in the Cheat Options. Activate that and you could live forever.

      Comment

      • Atarlost
        Swordsman
        • Apr 2007
        • 441

        #4
        Cheat death is an unsatisfying way to do things. With a traditional save/load system you can treat tough battles as repeatable puzzles and experiment with ways to overcome them. With cheat death you still only get one chance to fight each battle.
        One Ring to rule them all. One Ring to bind them.
        One Ring to bring them all and in the darkness interrupt the movie.

        Comment

        • Donald Jonker
          Knight
          • Jun 2008
          • 593

          #5
          Originally posted by Donald Jonker
          I don't think there are any *bands which support this, but I vaguely recall reading about a game on r.g.r.misc that does, so you may want to investigate there.
          Doh! POWDER has a built-in option to savescum that operates similarly to traditional save games. You still have to save & quit, but if you die, you can restore your last save. I play it fairly often - strange I didn't recall it had that feature. Then again, I never use it.
          Bands, / Those funny little plans / That never work quite right.
          -Mercury Rev

          Comment

          • Nolendil
            Adept
            • May 2007
            • 171

            #6
            Save Scummer is great but that's not what you'd call a traditional save system
            A(3.2.0) C "Angdiira II" DP L:36 DL:44(2200') A+ R+ Sp w:Whip of Westernesse(+10,+10)(+2)
            A Mx H- D c-- f- PV+ s- d P++ M+
            C- S-- I So B++ ac GHB- SQ+ RQ++ V+

            Comment

            • Dubtrain
              Scout
              • Feb 2009
              • 33

              #7
              Just copy the save file. Why should there be in-game code for that? How would in-game code be better than copying a file yourself?

              Comment

              • Nolendil
                Adept
                • May 2007
                • 171

                #8
                In the dark days before I saw the light, I used to save scum but, even doing so, I never won because, after several copies, I eventually managed to overwrite my backup with my current dead character
                A(3.2.0) C "Angdiira II" DP L:36 DL:44(2200') A+ R+ Sp w:Whip of Westernesse(+10,+10)(+2)
                A Mx H- D c-- f- PV+ s- d P++ M+
                C- S-- I So B++ ac GHB- SQ+ RQ++ V+

                Comment

                • Pete Mack
                  Prophet
                  • Apr 2007
                  • 6883

                  #9
                  I find the title of this thread a little disconcerting: permanent death _is_ the traditional save format, going all the way back to Rogue (and presumably D&D 1.)

                  Comment

                  • Atarlost
                    Swordsman
                    • Apr 2007
                    • 441

                    #10
                    Permadeath is used by very few non-rougelike games. Going back to e.g. Ultima and I think Zork and Adventure. I can't think of anything that lets you save, but not load a save after death that isn't a rougelike. Permadeath is very nonstandard.
                    One Ring to rule them all. One Ring to bind them.
                    One Ring to bring them all and in the darkness interrupt the movie.

                    Comment

                    • Zyphyr
                      Adept
                      • Jan 2008
                      • 135

                      #11
                      There are a number of very old games with permadeath. Sure, it is unusual at best but it is still traditional.

                      Comment

                      • Atarlost
                        Swordsman
                        • Apr 2007
                        • 441

                        #12
                        But everyone knew what the OP was talking about.

                        Let's try an analogy. In Europe it it traditional to cook meat, but there's one French dish, the name of which I can't recall at the moment, which involves raw beef. Raw beef is a tradition, but the tradition is to cook the stuff until any bacteria are dead.
                        One Ring to rule them all. One Ring to bind them.
                        One Ring to bring them all and in the darkness interrupt the movie.

                        Comment

                        • Magnate
                          Angband Devteam member
                          • May 2007
                          • 5110

                          #13
                          Originally posted by Atarlost
                          But everyone knew what the OP was talking about.

                          Let's try an analogy. In Europe it it traditional to cook meat, but there's one French dish, the name of which I can't recall at the moment, which involves raw beef. Raw beef is a tradition, but the tradition is to cook the stuff until any bacteria are dead.
                          Steak hachette?
                          "Been away so long I hardly knew the place, gee it's good to be back home" - The Beatles

                          Comment

                          • Nolendil
                            Adept
                            • May 2007
                            • 171

                            #14
                            "Steak haché" (not "hachette", this one means "small axe" ^^ ) is usually cooked.
                            "Steak tartare" is raw meat however but I'm not sure it's typicaly french.
                            A(3.2.0) C "Angdiira II" DP L:36 DL:44(2200') A+ R+ Sp w:Whip of Westernesse(+10,+10)(+2)
                            A Mx H- D c-- f- PV+ s- d P++ M+
                            C- S-- I So B++ ac GHB- SQ+ RQ++ V+

                            Comment

                            • Nick
                              Vanilla maintainer
                              • Apr 2007
                              • 9634

                              #15
                              Originally posted by Atarlost
                              Permadeath is used by very few non-rougelike games. Going back to e.g. Ultima and I think Zork and Adventure. I can't think of anything that lets you save, but not load a save after death that isn't a rougelike. Permadeath is very nonstandard.
                              In the context of being on an Angband forum, though, one might expect "traditional" to mean "traditional for Angband".

                              Also, I was going to say something about steak tartare being Moulin Rougelike, but I think that's a bad idea.
                              One for the Dark Lord on his dark throne
                              In the Land of Mordor where the Shadows lie.

                              Comment

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