Thoughts (definitely not a rant) about Maia

[Selkie]

* My biggest issue with the Maia is when they transform. I've lost two very high level characters to a Maia that transformed into a vortex. Their attack seems to be much more powerful than a standard vortex (am I correct in this?) It makes them a threat, which I like, but highly unpredictable (which I don't)

* There are too many of them appearing in the dungeon - these are some of the most powerful beings in Tolkien's world and should be rarer. Also it's a bit like killing farmer Maggot, I always feel like "Am I the good guy?" when I'm hacking away at them. I don't know enough about Tolkien but surely these lads were anti-Morgorth?

* The various flavours of Maia don't feel distinct enough and I can never remember which is which. I'm not sure what the answer is here, but by contrast the dragons all feel so unique, even the hydras have their own particular flavour.

Like I say this is not a rant (definitely not a rant) and consider that I just lost a dlvl50 character who had dispatched Sauron, Witch King, Cantoras and the Tarrasque (the latter only needed one *healing potion to kill). I was tough, I still don't quite know how he died to a Maia vortex appearing out of nowhere

[Selkie]

Also, while I'm not ranting....

How can a non unique Maia of Aule transform into Quaker the Master of the Earth on a whim?

No other monster in Angband can just turn into a scary unique whenever they fancy it

[wobbly]

* My biggest issue with the Maia is when they transform. I've lost two very high level characters to a Maia that transformed into a vortex. Their attack seems to be much more powerful than a standard vortex (am I correct in this?) It makes them a threat, which I like, but highly unpredictable (which I don't)

Breathe weapons damage is based on monster hps (current hps), with a damage cap based on the element. The caps are listed here:

https://github.com/angband/angband/blob/master/lib/gamedata/projection.txt

A Maia has a lot more hps then a vortex and is likely to be hitting the cap.

[Thraalbee]

Wiruin (also a "v") is far worse than transformed Maiar and appears later. The way it is now fits with the learning curve. First v's were bad, then ok if you resist their element, then you learn they can be very bad in the late game. Now at least there is a chance that you will survive a level with wiruin when that happens.

[Selkie]

Breathe weapons damage is based on monster hps (current hps), with a damage cap based on the element. The caps are listed here:

https://github.com/angband/angband/blob/master/lib/gamedata/projection.txt

A Maia has a lot more hps then a vortex and is likely to be hitting the cap.

Exactly, so a Maia goes from becoming a general annoyance to a three breath death machine. It's really hard to stay on top of. So I'm fighting a few Maia. One has transformed into a chaos vortex. I teleport away because things get a bit hot. Perhaps I have a chaos or shard hole in my resistances, that's doable with over 800hp and ESP. I know I could likely survive a breath from a D even if I get clumsy, but I don't because I have detect fear and telepathy. I run down a corridor and get breathed to death by a 'v' super soldier. It's really annoying

[LordRotharoth]

I have always disliked Maia, they need nerfed or something along the lines of that.

[archolewa]

I have always disliked Maia, they need nerfed or something along the lines of that.

They're not as bad as ranger chieftains, if only because you have reliable TO by the time they start showing up. But yeah, the whole Maia fighting you feels even more off these days after the monster rework. It was tolerable when you were also fighting Radagast and the Vala of the Sun (I forget her name), but now that the Maia uniques have been reworked to be Maia who aren't exactly nice, even if they aren't exactly evil, it feels a little bit weird to see a Maia and a Balrog chilling in a vault having tea.

I chalk it up to Maia that have been seduced by Morgoth, but who haven't yet become so corrupted they lose their original identity and become Balrogs.

[Nick]

Sauron started out as a Maia of Aule, so presumably the ones you meet could be corrupted or at least ambivalent.

[wobbly]

Maybe they're just after your drop?

[Angdrim]

I just make it a point to not fight them.

But they don't fit flavor-wise. Neither did the angels that preceded them.

[DavidMedley]

Sauron started out as a Maia of Aule, so presumably the ones you meet could be corrupted or at least ambivalent.

I agree with this, and it's even mentioned in some or all of the descriptions. Saruman is also a Maia. The Balrogs are (probably retconned) Maiar.

9 monsters with "maia" in the name all have maximum sleepiness. I think of that as "You have to piss them off for them to want to fight you."

If this calculator is right, with 0 stealth and staying 10 spaces away it would take 178 turns on average to wake a Maia.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1nAVk2AodMHloqhLBzZm7p_s4mne3My4Kyo9wODJWAFQ/edit#gid=754240043

[Selkie]

I don't doubt you David, the code is the code. But anecdotally they feel like ruthless Terminator killing machines who are wired on coffee

[archolewa]

I don't doubt you David, the code is the code. But anecdotally they feel like ruthless Terminator killing machines who are wired on coffee

Especially their pits. Maybe you interrupted a coffee party?

[Selkie]

Ok so I've just had a Maia of Aule transform into Quaker Master of the Earth after I'd already slain him.

Earlier in the game a Maia transformed into Huan, when Huan already existed on that level locked in a cell on a mega vault.

I'm not sure about either of these warps in the space time continuum.

[bughunter]

I'm not sure about either of these warps in the space time continuum.

Yeah, the posthumous Quaker transformation just happened to me, too.

But since the polymorph spell description doesn't appear to require a check if the target form's original is still alive, it didn't bother me.

(What I dwelled on was that, again, the transformed A was easier to kill than the original A. Happens a lot.)

(But not always...)