Bonuses at level 20, 40 etc

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  • Mark
    Adept
    • Oct 2007
    • 121

    Bonuses at level 20, 40 etc

    Am I right that Rangers get an extra shot per round at level 20, and again at 40?

    Are there any other bonuses like this in the game, for other classes?
  • Mondkalb
    Knight
    • Apr 2007
    • 891

    #2
    Yep, that's right.
    Also, warriors get immunity to fear at clevel 30, rogues get +1 stealth every ten levels.
    My Angband winners so far

    My FAangband efforts so far

    Comment

    • Pete Mack
      Prophet
      • Apr 2007
      • 6697

      #3
      And priests and mages get increased ball spell diameter at CL 26, which is a pretty useless bonus. In the good old days, warriors got an extra blow, too. That really set them apart from Paladins and Rogues for melee, since getting more than five blows now is extremely difficult, except with the lightest weapons (which you mostly don't use in the endgame.) I really miss that feature.

      Originally posted by Mondkalb
      Yep, that's right.
      Also, warriors get immunity to fear at clevel 30, rogues get +1 stealth every ten levels.

      Comment

      • Werbaer
        Adept
        • Aug 2014
        • 182

        #4
        Originally posted by Pete Mack
        In the good old days, warriors got an extra blow, too.
        When was that?

        I played various versions from 2.7.9v6 up to 3.0.5. Plus PcAngband 1.4.1, which AFAIK was just a port of Angband 2.6.0. In none of these versions, warriors got an extra blow.
        (although some people advocated for it for many years)

        Comment

        • Philip
          Knight
          • Jul 2009
          • 881

          #5
          It wasn't technically an extra blow. It was just a different blows table that allowed for 6 blows with most weapons, while everyone else was at 5 or fewer. In practice, an extra blow for warriors.

          Comment

          • Sky
            Veteran
            • Oct 2016
            • 2309

            #6
            Really? I thought rangers got +1 shot at CL1, and that's it.
            "i can take this dracolich"

            Comment

            • Werbaer
              Adept
              • Aug 2014
              • 182

              #7
              Originally posted by Philip
              It wasn't technically an extra blow. It was just a different blows table that allowed for 6 blows with most weapons, while everyone else was at 5 or fewer. In practice, an extra blow for warriors.
              6 blows with a very high strength and a decent dexterity for weapons weighting 24 lb or less.
              A real extra blow would have made warriors to perfer a heavier weapon over a dagger at early levels.

              Comment

              • Pete Mack
                Prophet
                • Apr 2007
                • 6697

                #8
                YES, warriors used to get +1 blow at around DL 30. It made getting 6 blows possible with pretty much any weapon in the game (except deathwreaker and grond.)
                This changed when fractional blows were added, circa V3.5.The result is a significant Nerf to the warrior class.

                Comment

                • Derakon
                  Prophet
                  • Dec 2009
                  • 8820

                  #9
                  Originally posted by Pete Mack
                  YES, warriors used to get +1 blow at around DL 30. It made getting 6 blows possible with pretty much any weapon in the game (except deathwreaker and grond.)
                  This changed when fractional blows were added, circa V3.5.The result is a significant Nerf to the warrior class.
                  I do not remember this ever having been a thing. Warriors have always had a different blows table, that went up to 6, as opposed to 5 or 4 for mage/priest. They never, to my knowledge, have just gotten a flat +1 blow.

                  Which isn't to say I'm opposed to such an idea.

                  Comment

                  • Pete Mack
                    Prophet
                    • Apr 2007
                    • 6697

                    #10
                    I don't have the 3.0.5 source handy, but I'm 99% sure warriors had nominal max blows 5, but with an extra blow added during midgame. It basically made warriors into heavy weapons specialists.

                    Comment

                    • Nick
                      Vanilla maintainer
                      • Apr 2007
                      • 9351

                      #11
                      3.0.5 blows table and comments:
                      Code:
                      /*
                       * This table is used to help calculate the number of blows the player can
                       * make in a single round of attacks (one player turn) with a normal weapon.
                       *
                       * This number ranges from a single blow/round for weak players to up to six
                       * blows/round for powerful warriors.
                       *
                       * Note that certain artifacts and ego-items give "bonus" blows/round.
                       *
                       * First, from the player class, we extract some values:
                       *
                       *    Warrior --> num = 6; mul = 5; div = MAX(30, weapon_weight);
                       *    Mage    --> num = 4; mul = 2; div = MAX(40, weapon_weight);
                       *    Priest  --> num = 5; mul = 3; div = MAX(35, weapon_weight);
                       *    Rogue   --> num = 5; mul = 3; div = MAX(30, weapon_weight);
                       *    Ranger  --> num = 5; mul = 4; div = MAX(35, weapon_weight);
                       *    Paladin --> num = 5; mul = 4; div = MAX(30, weapon_weight);
                       *
                       * To get "P", we look up the relevant "adj_str_blow[]" (see above),
                       * multiply it by "mul", and then divide it by "div", rounding down.
                       *
                       * To get "D", we look up the relevant "adj_dex_blow[]" (see above),
                       * note especially column 6 (DEX 18/101) and 11 (DEX 18/150).
                       *
                       * The player gets "blows_table[P][D]" blows/round, as shown below,
                       * up to a maximum of "num" blows/round, plus any "bonus" blows/round.
                       */
                      const byte blows_table[12][12] =
                      {
                      	/* P/D */
                      	/* 0,   1,   2,   3,   4,   5,   6,   7,   8,   9,  10,  11+ */
                      
                      	/* 0  */
                      	{  1,   1,   1,   1,   1,   1,   2,   2,   2,   2,   2,   3 },
                      
                      	/* 1  */
                      	{  1,   1,   1,   1,   2,   2,   3,   3,   3,   4,   4,   4 },
                      
                      	/* 2  */
                      	{  1,   1,   2,   2,   3,   3,   4,   4,   4,   5,   5,   5 },
                      
                      	/* 3  */
                      	{  1,   2,   2,   3,   3,   4,   4,   4,   5,   5,   5,   5 },
                      
                      	/* 4  */
                      	{  1,   2,   2,   3,   3,   4,   4,   5,   5,   5,   5,   5 },
                      
                      	/* 5  */
                      	{  2,   2,   3,   3,   4,   4,   5,   5,   5,   5,   5,   6 },
                      
                      	/* 6  */
                      	{  2,   2,   3,   3,   4,   4,   5,   5,   5,   5,   5,   6 },
                      
                      	/* 7  */
                      	{  2,   3,   3,   4,   4,   4,   5,   5,   5,   5,   5,   6 },
                      
                      	/* 8  */
                      	{  3,   3,   3,   4,   4,   4,   5,   5,   5,   5,   6,   6 },
                      
                      	/* 9  */
                      	{  3,   3,   4,   4,   4,   4,   5,   5,   5,   5,   6,   6 },
                      
                      	/* 10 */
                      	{  3,   3,   4,   4,   4,   4,   5,   5,   5,   6,   6,   6 },
                      
                      	/* 11+ */
                      	{  3,   3,   4,   4,   4,   4,   5,   5,   6,   6,   6,   6 },
                      };
                      So in fact every class could get 6 blows out of the blows table, but the non-warrior classes were capped.
                      One for the Dark Lord on his dark throne
                      In the Land of Mordor where the Shadows lie.

                      Comment

                      • Derakon
                        Prophet
                        • Dec 2009
                        • 8820

                        #12
                        Huh, and priests could get 5 blows/round back then.

                        Comment

                        • kandrc
                          Swordsman
                          • Dec 2007
                          • 299

                          #13
                          Originally posted by Derakon
                          Huh, and priests could get 5 blows/round back then.
                          No. I don't recall how it worked in Frog-knows, but in 2.x, it was 1 blow table with priest and mage limited to 4 blows, warrior allowed 6, and everybody else limited to 5.

                          Comment

                          • Derakon
                            Prophet
                            • Dec 2009
                            • 8820

                            #14
                            Originally posted by kandrc
                            No. I don't recall how it worked in Frog-knows, but in 2.x, it was 1 blow table with priest and mage limited to 4 blows, warrior allowed 6, and everybody else limited to 5.
                            I'm just looking at the code Nick posted. Specifically this bit:
                            Code:
                             *    Warrior --> num = 6; mul = 5; div = MAX(30, weapon_weight);
                             *    Mage    --> num = 4; mul = 2; div = MAX(40, weapon_weight);
                             *    Priest  --> num = 5; mul = 3; div = MAX(35, weapon_weight);
                             *    Rogue   --> num = 5; mul = 3; div = MAX(30, weapon_weight);
                             *    Ranger  --> num = 5; mul = 4; div = MAX(35, weapon_weight);
                             *    Paladin --> num = 5; mul = 4; div = MAX(30, weapon_weight);
                            It's entirely possible that the cap on Priests has fluctuated over the years, so my "back then" should only refer to 3.0.5. Sorry for the confusion.

                            Comment

                            • PowerWyrm
                              Prophet
                              • Apr 2008
                              • 2941

                              #15
                              Originally posted by Derakon
                              Huh, and priests could get 5 blows/round back then.
                              No, priests were capped at 4 (in class.txt). There's just a typo in the comment.
                              PWMAngband variant maintainer - check https://github.com/draconisPW/PWMAngband (or http://www.mangband.org/forum/viewforum.php?f=9) to learn more about this new variant!

                              Comment

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