Mage armor encumberance

[mushroom patch]

This is a ridiculous claim. In no-sell games, I'm managing inventory, and making equipment decisions on the cusp of encumbrance limits until usually about clvl 30/dlvl 90+. When I used to have to deal with selling, I'd only have one or two inventory slots for saleable objects. Said objects, if encumbering, were left on the dungeon floor while I adventured. 20 years ago, when I followed the "guides" (and didn't win), I'd have 10 or more slots devoted to revenue. I have to argue that if you're only facing encumbrance limits when selling, that you're not playing a strategy that maximizes winning/<variable> where <variable> is almost anything.

You do this because you incorrectly believe it will help you, not because you have to. You probably think a lot of unimportant resistances are actually important.

I'd add that no real sense of progression over 100 levels just makes the game feel like drudgery.

I usually assume that people who argue with me on these forums know something about the game, have won it before, etc., but I'm starting to wonder with this one.

[Mikko Lehtinen]

I think a new player may intuitively assume that trying to evade mage armor encumbrance penalty is a good strategy, even in the late game. (Since the game keeps messaging about it.)

If the penalty is not a big deal in the late game, and you're better off ignoring it, perhaps the game should communicate this to the player more clearly?

A binary penalty might work well? Either you would have the (sizable) penalty to spellcasting or not. The lbs encumbrance limit could perhaps increase with levels.

[kandrc]

You do this because you incorrectly believe it will help you, not because you have to. You probably think a lot of unimportant resistances are actually important.

You're silly. You assume I'm carrying swaps. I haven't carried a swap in 20 years. It's not at all uncommon for me to be down in the 90s and not yet have rbase. Inventory weight is filled up with wands, rods,, scrolls, and potions. If I'm playing a physically strong character, I may have some staves, too, but for the weaker race/class combos, they'reusually too heavy. Also only carry a single copy of each spellbook.

[mushroom patch]

I only assumed that what you said in your previous comment accurately describes your play.

[Philip]

mushroom patch, is there a specific reason you choose to be an asshole? I mean, you probably have some points to make, but I can't get to them through all the levels of condescension.

As for encumbrance/spellpoint loss from heavy armor, both of them certainly have a purpose. Encumbrance is there to make sure you need to make equipment and inventory decisions. It becomes less important once you have more than +10 permanent speed, and a lot of strength, though both of these could be changed. Make encumbrance take away a percentage of the energy you gain per turn (in effect, percentage reduction of speed), and/or reduce the effects of very high strength on carrying capacity. Spellpoint loss from heavy armor is there to restrict armor on mages. I think it should be STR/DEX based, and it should (again) be a percentage reduction, which would create higher allowances for heavy armor at the end in a way that maybe makes more sense, while probably not absolutely crippling early characters for wanting to wear that chain-mail of elvenkind or whatever.

[mushroom patch]

mushroom patch, is there a specific reason you choose to be an asshole? I mean, you probably have some points to make, but I can't get to them through all the levels of condescension.

It's hard to express how much it pains me to hear you couldn't get to my points. I know you tried hard, like the guy who said without encumbrance there would be "no real sense of progression over 100 levels."

[Carnivean]

It's hard to express how much it pains me to hear you couldn't get to my points. I know you tried hard, like the guy who said without encumbrance there would be "no real sense of progression over 100 levels."

Not only are you an asshole, you have presented a complete strawman of what I said. Either you have so little ability to comprehend what I was saying, or you are working under the assumption that people will think that that's what I'm saying.

You're either a troll or so completely deluded that you don't believe that being an asshole causes everyone to completely disregard you.

[mushroom patch]

Oh, your point was more challenging than I realized? Please, elaborate.

[Derakon]

Oh, your point was more challenging than I realized? Please, elaborate.

You know, he's right: your tone on this forum is incredibly condescending. It is ruining your ability to convince people of your correctness. So basically, as I see it, you have two options:

1) Continue to behave as you have been, and do an awful job of actually communicating, in which case why are you bothering to participate on a forum? The purpose of the forum after all is to communicate.

2) Be more diplomatic, and learn to disagree with people without insulting them. Explain yourself more fully instead of (as far as I can tell) starting with the premise that your stance is so obviously correct that anyone who disagrees with you is incompetent. In brief, try to convince people that you're right instead of just telling them that you are, which is what you've mostly been doing.

[mushroom patch]

It's okay if people aren't convinced.

[Derakon]

It's okay if people aren't convinced.

No, it's really not. If you aren't communicating effectively and you're insulting people, then you're acting as a net negative on the community. You can do better. You should do better.

[mushroom patch]

Yes, it is okay if people aren't convinced.

For example, I found the argument you made in your first post in this thread extremely unconvincing. That's okay.

[Ingwe Ingweron]

Yes, it is okay if people aren't convinced.

For example, I found the argument you made in your first post in this thread extremely unconvincing. That's okay.

But, in addition to being unconvincing, your argument style has been offensive, off-putting, and downright rude. So, I for one no longer listen to what you say.

[Timo Pietilä]

But, in addition to being unconvincing, your argument style has been offensive, off-putting, and downright rude. So, I for one no longer listen to what you say.

Person can be added to ignore list (user CP, edit ignore list). I have two names in mine. If mushroom patch doesn't learn he will find himself quite lonely here soonish.

[mushroom patch]

I present a thesis, I engage the antithesis. When the antithesis is crap, e.g. in this thread, I sometimes find it hard to contain my disappointment, it's true.

Anyway, I feel I've adequately presented my perspective on various aspects of angband's design (or evolution) and some of the pushback has been interesting. That's enough for me.