A Few Questions/Observations From an Old Player

[Magnate]

I guess I didn't explain myself properly on the quiver issue.

Previously, I've kept my quiver to a single slot in my inventory. There were no problems when I added different types of ammo to the quiver.

In this particular case I had a full inventory including some bolts/bullets which were not in the quiver. I had two inventory slots taken up by the quiver. One had 99 arrrows, the second had something like 10 arrows. I tried adding the bolts to my quiver. Based on previous behavior, I would have expected them to be added to the second slot which would now leave me with a spare inventory slot. Instead I got a message saying something along the lines of I needed to drop something before I could add the bolts/bullets.

As an example:

u. 25 bolts
v. quiver slot with 99 items (arrows)
w. quiver slot with 10 items (arrows)

When trying to equip the bolts, I get the error message instead of:

u. quiver slot with 99 items (arrows)
v. quiver slot with 35 items (arrows and bolts)
w. empty slot

which is what I expected because I had no problem adding different types of ammo when I kept it to a single slot.

Have you upgraded to 3.4.0? The stack limit has dropped from 99 to 40, and I'm not sure if there is any error-checking on loading. So you might have loaded up a savefile with 99 arrows in a single quiver slot, but can't add any more because it's actually big enough to occupy three inventory slots.

Alternatively, maybe you have 10 different types of ammo in your quiver already? The quiver only has 10 slots and you can't add any more after that, even if there are fewer than 40 items in total.

Next time you get the error, post a chardump so we can see the error messages and the context.

[Oramin]

I guess I didn't explain myself properly on the quiver issue.

Previously, I've kept my quiver to a single slot in my inventory. There were no problems when I added different types of ammo to the quiver.

In this particular case I had a full inventory including some bolts/bullets which were not in the quiver. I had two inventory slots taken up by the quiver. One had 99 arrrows, the second had something like 10 arrows. I tried adding the bolts to my quiver. Based on previous behavior, I would have expected them to be added to the second slot which would now leave me with a spare inventory slot. Instead I got a message saying something along the lines of I needed to drop something before I could add the bolts/bullets.

As an example:

u. 25 bolts
v. quiver slot with 99 items (arrows)
w. quiver slot with 10 items (arrows)

When trying to equip the bolts, I get the error message instead of:

u. quiver slot with 99 items (arrows)
v. quiver slot with 35 items (arrows and bolts)
w. empty slot

which is what I expected because I had no problem adding different types of ammo when I kept it to a single slot.

Edit:

typo

[Derakon]

Possible Bug:

I'm carrying enough arrows to fill up two inventory slots (at 99 per slot). I noticed something a bit odd. Previously, when I had space when using a single inventory slot, I could add different types of ammo into the same slot. For example, if I had entirely arrows, there weren't any problems with adding bolts.

This time, however, when I tried to add a different type of ammo to my second inventory slot, I was informed that I would have to drop something. If anybody wants to try replicating it, I had no free inventory slots at the time (in other words, I was putting them in my quiver to free up the inventory slot).

The way the quiver works is that every 99 (or 40 in the newer version) ammo in it take up 1 inventory slot in your backpack. Its sole reason for existence is to avoid penalizing the player for carrying around small stacks of ammo. If you have a full stack of ammo, it makes no difference, mechanics-wise, if it's in your inventory or in your quiver.

[buzzkill]

I'm also curious about Zephyr Hounds - are they always awake? Is there any way to get a high enough Stealth to sneak up on them. For example, a Halfling Rogue with Stealth gear in every slot?

Zepher Hounds always start out awake. Your stealth is useless here. Not sure if they can be slept or not?

[Oramin]

I'm still working on the Half-Troll Warrior. Slow going because of needing to get better armor; actually, not so much need, just I would feel a bit more comfortable. I have plenty of weapons, though. Current batch is Theoden (for ESP) and Belthronding with Eonwe for tough fights.

Possible Bug:

I'm carrying enough arrows to fill up two inventory slots (at 99 per slot). I noticed something a bit odd. Previously, when I had space when using a single inventory slot, I could add different types of ammo into the same slot. For example, if I had entirely arrows, there weren't any problems with adding bolts.

This time, however, when I tried to add a different type of ammo to my second inventory slot, I was informed that I would have to drop something. If anybody wants to try replicating it, I had no free inventory slots at the time (in other words, I was putting them in my quiver to free up the inventory slot).

Question:

I'm also curious about Zephyr Hounds - are they always awake? Is there any way to get a high enough Stealth to sneak up on them. For example, a Halfling Rogue with Stealth gear in every slot?

[Timo Pietilä]

Ok, what's with Silent Watchers?

What is causing the difference in behavior?

Murphys law. I have noticed same too, sometimes they just sit there doing practically nothing, sometimes they summon frequently enough that you have to leave them alone.

Looks like it uses spells one time in six, and spell list has seven spells from which three are practically harmless (shriek is harmless only as long as there is no other monster in LoS).

[Timo Pietilä]

a level-20 priest would do IIRC 2 * (3d6+30) damage vs. evil targets

There's a "OoD" missing in that sentence. Priest Orb of Draining.

[Oramin]

Hmm, really unlucky then. Thanks for the information.

[Derakon]

Nope. The monster AI in Angband is literally:

If randint(cast chance) == 1:
    cast a spell at random
else:
    if player is adjacent:
        attack player
    else:
        move closer to player

Silent Watchers cast spells 1 time in 6; 2 out of 7 of their spells are summoning spells. They move at normal speed. Thus statistically you should see a summoning spell be cast 1 in every 21 turns. Anything more than that and you're just being unlucky.

[Oramin]

Sorry, I should have specified that I'm using Amrod and arrows that are a minimum of +6 to damage for an average damage of 96.8. Levels for all characters would have been around 35 or so.

Does having a lousy Stealth make them more likely to aggressively summon things? Or is there a range within which they start summoning? Bow range is less than spell range so I generally have to be closer.

[Derakon]

The AI doesn't care what race/class you use. My guess is that your previous characters had better ranged damage capability. In particular, Silent Watchers are evil, so your priest would have obliterated the thing -- a level-20 priest would do IIRC 2 * (3d6+30) damage vs. evil targets, i.e. average 81 damage/cast. A mage with a 9d8 firebolt would have average damage of 40.5/round (assuming they duck out of LOS to rest up for mana). Both will hit about 95% of the time.

Meanwhile your warrior is probably using something like a (+8, +8) longbow and unenchanted 1d4 arrows, giving average damage of 31.5 assuming he hits. Silent Watchers have pretty decent AC, and IIRC your hit chance with bows drops off with distance slightly; your hit rate will be significantly worse than the failure rates your full-casters were getting for their spells.

[Oramin]

Ok, what's with Silent Watchers?

With my previous two characters (Dwarf Priest and Gnome Mage), I had no problems with them. I would just shoot them from range (with spells) and they would just sit there.

I discovered quickly enough that getting up close and personal with them with my Half-Troll Warrior isn't a particularly good idea, so I started shooting them from a long distance with my bow. This isn't working either since they keep summoning things (last time was a Beholder).

What is causing the difference in behavior?

[Oramin]

Oh, in case anybody was wondering, I finally found my first artifact.

I think getting Anduril as your first artifact officially means that the game does *not* hate Half-Troll Warriors.

[Oramin]

Well, I finally got my first level feeling higher than "worthwhile" when I got down to level 20. Apparently a Potion of Augmentation can trigger the "Superb" feeling since that was the only major goodie I found; not that I'm complaining since it saved me 123,000 buying potions from the Black Market.

Yeah, I remember back when I first started playing and it seemed that I almost immediately got the Phial followed swiftly by Hithlomir every single game.

[Derakon]

That sounds normal to me. Artifacts are rare; even the Phial is no longer remotely a guaranteed early drop (unlike how it used to be where you'd think something was wrong if you didn't find it by 500'). Especially with half-troll warriors, you can dive so quickly that it's not unreasonable to not even have any ego gear before 1000'.