What weapons are better than the Glaive of Pain?

[ulrichvonbek]

I realized just how brutal this weapon is when I saw it came within 6 points of damage to the MoD of Slay Evil I had when it came to evil monsters. MoD was way in front when it came to undead & demons, but the GoP was way in front when it came to non-evil monsters.

I guess I could check the spoilers, but I'd rather hear from people.

[SSK]

I realized just how brutal this weapon is when I saw it came within 6 points of damage to the MoD of Slay Evil I had when it came to evil monsters. MoD was way in front when it came to undead & demons, but the GoP was way in front when it came to non-evil monsters.

I guess I could check the spoilers, but I'd rather hear from people.

It's a big weapon for sure.
Generally, though, certain other weapons are considered better because they are also big and have other important properties (resistances, speed boosts, sustains, ESP, immunities etc). Such weapons include:

Ringil
Aule
Durin
Eonwe

Deathwreaker
Zarcuthra, and to a lesser extent
Doomcaller
Anguirel

are nice if you don't mind aggravation or are using other items causing aggravation

Next level:
Eowyn
Ulmo
Fundin Bluecloak.

My opinion.

[Tregonsee]

It also depends on what character you are running. Aule was much better for me than GoP because I was a priest.

[Timo Pietilä]

I realized just how brutal this weapon is when I saw it came within 6 points of damage to the MoD of Slay Evil I had when it came to evil monsters. MoD was way in front when it came to undead & demons, but the GoP was way in front when it came to non-evil monsters.

I guess I could check the spoilers, but I'd rather hear from people.

There is a problem with current blows-calculation, because it allows max blows with MoD even with warrior, which makes high-ego MoD way more powerful than most artifacts. (It also makes Deathwreaker an insane weapon, but that's another matter).

While I like the change that makes heavier weapons more preferable, I think it has overshoot a bit. Max blows with MoD should not be easy to obtain, if even possible.

Better than GoP? Ringil, Aule, Eonwe, Durin (maybe), Doomcaller (aggravates), Deathwreaker (aggravates). If you need speed, then maybe also Eowyn, Fundin and Aglarang (and if you need something else that weapon provides, list increases a lot).

[ulrichvonbek]

If warriors can get max blows with MoD, I probably should have gotten my dex up higher with my warrior then. IIRC, I never got more than 5 with Ulmo, which I would have been quite content to melee Morgoth with, or GoP, which showed up later.

I looked at my char dump, and I had 18/*** STR and 18/151 DEX. (That was on 3.1.2v2, so the calculations may have been different that version.)

[Bogatyr]

It's a big weapon for sure.
Generally, though, certain other weapons are considered better because they are also big and have other important properties (resistances, speed boosts, sustains, ESP, immunities etc). Such weapons include:

Ringil
Aule
Durin
Eonwe

Deathwreaker
Zarcuthra, and to a lesser extent
Doomcaller
Anguirel

are nice if you don't mind aggravation or are using other items causing aggravation

Next level:
Eowyn
Ulmo
Fundin Bluecloak.

My opinion.

I'm trying to see how Anguirel can compare to GoP which I've found for my rogue and absolutely love it as my fighting swap weapon (as opposed to Nimloth which is my speed/stealth swap weapon). GoP for me gives average 423/round (of course against everything) and in practice a lot more with all the criticals, and Anguirel gives only 286 and it's a lot lighter so less crits. And it's aggravating so that's against my rogue's sneaking around preference.

[Derakon]

I'm trying to see how Anguirel can compare to GoP which I've found for my rogue and absolutely love it as my fighting swap weapon (as opposed to Nimloth which is my speed/stealth swap weapon). GoP for me gives average 423/round (of course against everything) and in practice a lot more with all the criticals, and Anguirel gives only 286 and it's a lot lighter so less crits. And it's aggravating so that's against my rogue's sneaking around preference.

Just a quick note: as I understand it, the damage/round calculation takes crits into account.

[Fendell Orcbane]

Ringil. I think with the +10 speed its pretty much the best weapon in the game. I had 50+ speed with my most recent winner. http://angband.oook.cz/ladder-show.php?id=15743 and Ringil was a big part of that. Although some other weapons cause more damage per round, that +10 speed boost always you to get another round on most monsters in V since not too many monsters go past +20, unlike other variants. So for V I'd say Ringil trumps even the Glave of Pain. But if you were playing NPP or FA that would be more open for debate, since a lot of high lvl monsters are at +20

[Derakon]

+50 speed? If you have over +30 base speed then it's time to swap Ringil out for a better-damaging weapon, because high-end speed gains are really pretty marginal. In fact, you only really need +30 to avoid getting double-moved; +40 only rarely gets you yourself a double-turn against monsters at +30.

[Philip]

The Glaive of Pain was best back in the day when you could Acid-brand it with a ring of Acid. That way, sauron would die immediately. Nowadays, it's handy as a big damage-dealer if you have everything covered and don't have the better weapons.

[Fendell Orcbane]

+50 speed? If you have over +30 base speed then it's time to swap Ringil out for a better-damaging weapon, because high-end speed gains are really pretty marginal. In fact, you only really need +30 to avoid getting double-moved; +40 only rarely gets you yourself a double-turn against monsters at +30.

Dude I pretty much thought the same, but I don't think Ive ever had a character with that much speed...and at +62 speed. I either a) double turned Morgoth every turn or often enough to feel that way. Also while i did some scumming I didn't do a lot of it, so while I might have come across one or two weapons that gave me more damage output, it not like I had much choice. And Ringil was more than enough. Plus it was nice to finish Morgoth off with Ringil : )

[Fendell Orcbane]

The Glaive of Pain was best back in the day when you could Acid-brand it with a ring of Acid. That way, sauron would die immediately. Nowadays, it's handy as a big damage-dealer if you have everything covered and don't have the better weapons.

I miss those days lol.

[Derakon]

Dude I pretty much thought the same, but I don't think Ive ever had a character with that much speed...and at +62 speed. I either a) double turned Morgoth every turn or often enough to feel that way. Also while i did some scumming I didn't do a lot of it, so while I might have come across one or two weapons that gave me more damage output, it not like I had much choice. And Ringil was more than enough. Plus it was nice to finish Morgoth off with Ringil : )

Ha! Well, fair enough. Sometimes you just have to pile bonuses on to see how far you can go.

[Fendell Orcbane]

Ha! Well, fair enough. Sometimes you just have to pile bonuses on to see how far you can go.

Yup. Its just more fun for me that way : )

[Timo Pietilä]

+50 speed? If you have over +30 base speed then it's time to swap Ringil out for a better-damaging weapon, because high-end speed gains are really pretty marginal. In fact, you only really need +30 to avoid getting double-moved; +40 only rarely gets you yourself a double-turn against monsters at +30.

+50 speed have to include RoS, maybe two. You have to ask which swap is better, RoS to RoDam or Ringil to Pain (if that is an option).

(4d5*2) (basically anything you care about are at least evil) + 25 + RoDam or 9d6 + 30. I think Ringil beats pretty much anything if you can do that swap with it.