3.2.0 remarks from a relative noob

[Starhawk]

I've never beaten Angband, my closest was a ranger who got eaten by the Tarrasque on DL90.

That said, my comments on 3.2.0:

I have been playing randart 3.1.2v2 and in comparison the drop rate seems to be MUCH lower. I haven't seen a single artifact yet, not even a Phial.

The beginning game (where I am usually stuck, since I die a lot) seems to be a lot harder. It's much more difficult to get 2 blows as a beginning character. The equipment list for my usual class (ranger) has also been nerfed, with the change from longbow to shortbow, and from broadsword to dagger. When you throw in also having only 26 gold to start.... ouch! I used to trade in the broadsword for a 2 blow weapon, buy a potion and a ?Phase, and stack up on arrows before entering the dungeon. No more.

Purple mushroom patches... I don't remember those! But I will in the future. My poor, drained CON. Ack!




On the up side, I just found a Potion of Experience lying on the ground on DL2 and am now level 30. Woooooohoo!

EDIT: and a vault on DL5 that I couldn't get to, because I had no way to dig through granite. Aaargh!

[dos350]

eek im also unsure of blows and new start gear, but new version seems good other than that.. i havnt gotten far in 320 or found any randarts..

no 4 blow start spear warrior eek~!~

but anyway where is color messages?~~ is my biggest question of 320, hoo!!~

[Derakon]

Starhawk: did you mean that randarts are rarer in 3.1.2 or rarer in 3.2.0? And what are you using as your basis for comparison?

Starting equipment got normalized awhile back so that each class starts with the same total value. Basically everyone starts with the same allowance (with characters that spend less on stats getting a bonus on top of that), and then they buy their starting equipment, at cost, with that allowance. Your starting gold is simply all that's left after buying your equipment. This meant that rangers had to get cheaper starting gear, since their old loadouts were so expensive. Especially, starting with a longbow would have meant getting hundreds of AU right off the bat if you wanted to sell it, now that launchers are more expensive. Similarly, warriors no longer start with chainmail and a broadsword; instead they get hard leather armor and a shortsword.

Fortunately, your shortbow should be more than adequate to see you through the first few levels. Ranged 2d4 attacks are nothing to sneeze at, and arrows are dirt cheap.

[takkaria]

but anyway where is color messages?~~ is my biggest question of 320, hoo!!~

What do you mean? Why are you expecting colour messages?

[Starhawk]

Starhawk: did you mean that randarts are rarer in 3.1.2 or rarer in 3.2.0? And what are you using as your basis for comparison?


Fortunately, your shortbow should be more than adequate to see you through the first few levels. Ranged 2d4 attacks are nothing to sneeze at, and arrows are dirt cheap.

So far I've found artifacts to be much rarer in 3.2.0. I play through the first 20 levels of the dungeon a LOT since I die so much. I'm used to having at least one or two artifacts drop if I survive to DL 25-ish. Maybe a light source and a pair of gauntlets or boots, rarely a weapon.

I have yet to see an artifact in 3.2.0... granted, I'm working off a much smaller basis -- so that's purely anecdotal evidence.

But, to me at least, it seems like the early game got a lot harder in this iteration.

Oh, and that Potion of Experience character I mentioned above? Dead. Got trapped by Mughash the Kobold Lord and his mob of archers, and didn't have an escape good enough to get away, since I hadn't gone back to town to pick up the book with Teleport Self yet.

[Magnate]

What do you mean? Why are you expecting colour messages?

Support for coloured messages is enabled, but the default scheme makes light use of it. Twilight has offered a much more colourful message.prf - it's available for download from the main 3.2 release thread.

[Magnate]

So far I've found artifacts to be much rarer in 3.2.0. I play through the first 20 levels of the dungeon a LOT since I die so much. I'm used to having at least one or two artifacts drop if I survive to DL 25-ish. Maybe a light source and a pair of gauntlets or boots, rarely a weapon.

I have yet to see an artifact in 3.2.0... granted, I'm working off a much smaller basis -- so that's purely anecdotal evidence.

But, to me at least, it seems like the early game got a lot harder in this iteration.

Oh, and that Potion of Experience character I mentioned above? Dead. Got trapped by Mughash the Kobold Lord and his mob of archers, and didn't have an escape good enough to get away, since I hadn't gone back to town to pick up the book with Teleport Self yet.

Hi Starhawk - yes, randarts are rarer in 3.2 - they were generally considered too common in 3.1.2, as well as too powerful. (They are very slightly less powerful in 3.2, but you will only notice the absence of +3 blows or shots on non-weapon items.) We now have a stats generator which shows that randart commonness is within 10% of that of normal artifacts, so it is neither easier nor harder to find them.

It certainly isn't difficult to get two blows with a starting character, or even over three. High-strength chars can easily get ~3.3 blows with a min weight weapon (dagger, main gauche, whip). This makes dealing with packs of jackals/spiders much easier, so not all the changes have made things harder.

Derakon is right that the kit values have been harmonised across the classes: this means much more money for magi and much less for rangers. I am planning on introducing kit selection to nightlies quite soon, so you'll have a few choices of starting kit (including starting with no kit and just money if you prefer to buy your own).

[buzzkill]

I noticed that weapon and armour drops/finds in general are much rarer, at least in the early levels. I'm not complaining though. Previously, I thought that they were far too common. It's feeling a little like Steam, and I like it.

[Magnate]

I noticed that weapon and armour drops/finds in general are much rarer, at least in the early levels. I'm not complaining though. Previously, I thought that they were far too common. It's feeling a little like Steam, and I like it.

Yes - in fact, this is much more likely to be the cause of the OP's observed drop in randart collection rate, since the main change resulting in too-common randarts was post-3.1.2 IIRC.

[Nomad]

I noticed that weapon and armour drops/finds in general are much rarer, at least in the early levels. I'm not complaining though. Previously, I thought that they were far too common. It's feeling a little like Steam, and I like it.

Yeah. I definitely like the new drop rates (even though I'm dying a lot more now). I actually find I'm trading up through levels of ego weapons, carrying a slay or even a plain enchanted weapon for a while before I find a *slay* and then carrying that for a bit before I find one of the better ones. Before I was pretty much guaranteed to have a branded weapon or better by the end of my first dungeon trip, and probably traded that up for an artefact weapon a few levels later. Low-level items have more of a window of usefulness now instead of being rendered obsolete by something you find half a dozen kills later.

So, yeah, the early game's definitely harder now, but the level of challenge feels about right to me. I find I'm relying on stuff like scrolls of blessing that I used to insta-squelch before, using up more consumables to handle early uniques, and generally having to play a lot more tactically to survive instead of casually stomping everything in melee for the first third of the dungeon.

[Magnate]

Yeah. I definitely like the new drop rates (even though I'm dying a lot more now). I actually find I'm trading up through levels of ego weapons, carrying a slay or even a plain enchanted weapon for a while before I find a *slay* and then carrying that for a bit before I find one of the better ones. Before I was pretty much guaranteed to have a branded weapon or better by the end of my first dungeon trip, and probably traded that up for an artefact weapon a few levels later. Low-level items have more of a window of usefulness now instead of being rendered obsolete by something you find half a dozen kills later.

So, yeah, the early game's definitely harder now, but the level of challenge feels about right to me. I find I'm relying on stuff like scrolls of blessing that I used to insta-squelch before, using up more consumables to handle early uniques, and generally having to play a lot more tactically to survive instead of casually stomping everything in melee for the first third of the dungeon.

That is the best news so far. I predict a jubilant takkaria. And quite a lot of praise to ewert, who did most of the rebalancing of wearables vs. consumables.

Maybe TMJ is finally a thing of the past ...

[dos350]

ty for answer maintainer,sir eek i was expecting cos it say something in changes , now i know is not default or watever maybe i will try that guys pref file, ee but it no really matter to me i was just wondering cos it say~~

[Zyphyr]

That is the best news so far. I predict a jubilant takkaria. And quite a lot of praise to ewert, who did most of the rebalancing of wearables vs. consumables.

Maybe TMJ is finally a thing of the past ...

If anything, I am seeing to many consumables. In particular, a brand new mage diving to level 10 picked up no less than 29 !CLW and 15 !CSW. It just got more absurd from there.

[Magnate]

If anything, I am seeing to many consumables. In particular, a brand new mage diving to level 10 picked up no less than 29 !CLW and 15 !CSW. It just got more absurd from there.

Consumables are certainly more generous than in 3.1.x, but hopefully not absurdly so. We can always adjust drops again for 3.3 if we've gone too far - and now we finally have statistics-collection sims to help us get it right.

[ewert]

Well, the low levels don't have much stuff that CAN drop, so it actually evens out after a few more levels as more stuff can drop (for example <10dlvl not many of the armor/weapon are available for creation).