Inconsistency in object.txt?

[Tiburon Silverflame]

This is in 3.1.2v2, standard release:

N:505:Multi-Hued Dragon Scale Mail~
G:[:v
I:38:6:0
W:90:0:200:150000
A:3:90 to 100
P:30:2d4:-2:0:10
F:RES_ACID | RES_ELEC | RES_FIRE | RES_COLD | RES_POIS |
F:IGNORE_ACID | IGNORE_ELEC | IGNORE_FIRE | IGNORE_COLD
ERAGON_MULTIHUED:25+1d225

The part that I question is the recharge time. All the other DSMs are like this:
ERAGON_BALANCE:300+1d300

That is, A + 1dA. So should the MH's recharge be 225+1d225?

[fizzix]

This is in 3.1.2v2, standard release:

N:505:Multi-Hued Dragon Scale Mail~
G:[:v
I:38:6:0
W:90:0:200:150000
A:3:90 to 100
P:30:2d4:-2:0:10
F:RES_ACID | RES_ELEC | RES_FIRE | RES_COLD | RES_POIS |
F:IGNORE_ACID | IGNORE_ELEC | IGNORE_FIRE | IGNORE_COLD
ERAGON_MULTIHUED:25+1d225

The part that I question is the recharge time. All the other DSMs are like this:
ERAGON_BALANCE:300+1d300

That is, A + 1dA. So should the MH's recharge be 225+1d225?

I'm guessing that since it's supposed to be more powerful it is given a faster recharge time (the breath itself is not any more powerful)

[PowerDiver]

I'm guessing that since it's supposed to be more powerful it is given a faster recharge time (the breath itself is not any more powerful)

225 vs 300 is already significantly faster. 25 vs 225 looks like a typo to me.

[Derakon]

Not like the breath activations are particularly useful as it stands. DSMs are largely useless, barring Balance and Power DSMs of course.

They might actually be worth using if they didn't have a recharge time, or if that time was 5-10 turns. You'd be giving up the defensive caapabilities of your normal body armor in exchange for getting a breath weapon. But then they'd be overpowered if you found them early on, and finding DSM at 500' isn't that uncommon.

[Pete Mack]

MHDSM is pretty nice armor, especially in variants where it activates for RESISTANCE.
GDSM and BrDSM can also be useful.
But I agree, the only real winners are BaDSM and PDSM, though I wouldn't mind finding DlchSM some time. (rNeth+IMCold+rPois+rConf)

[fyonn]

But I agree, the only real winners are BaDSM and PDSM, though I wouldn't mind finding DlchSM some time. (rNeth+IMCold+rPois+rConf)

now that would be a nice armour find...

[Derakon]

Hm. Hellish DSM => immunity to fire? Frozen DSM, Caustic DSM, and Shocking DSM for the other three upgraded base classes.

Or, heck, just make the base Red, Blue, Black, and White DSMs give immunity to their respective elements.

We could also have Wyvern Leather Scale Mail which gives resistance to poison and does nothing else. It could be moderately common in the dlvl 20-40 range; someone might actually equip it!

[Pete Mack]

I wasn't thinking of Elemental Wyrms; I was thinking of Dracolich. Although, on further thought scale mail from a dracolich doesn't make a lot of sense:

The skeletal form of a once-great dragon, enchanted by magic most perilous. Its animated form strikes with speed and drains life from its prey to satisfy its hunger.

[fyonn]

I can't remember the last time I actually wore DSM. it's a great idea, but by the time it shows up you're wearing artefact armour which gives you much needed resistances. there's too many different types that appear too deep I think.

I think that making the basic 4 give immunity to that element (and maybe resistances to the other 3) and making them a bit deeper/more rare could work. and then make the other DSM's include the basic 4 plus their colour. so green DSM would be Rbase+RPois, etc. then they might well be good competition for some of the lower artefact armours.

right now, I don't even bother bringing them to the surface to sell.

dave

PS. question is, should MHDSM provide 4 immunities? that might be too strong.. that said, I've never seen one...

[Derakon]

Pete: well, make it Dracolich Bone Armor then, instead of Scale Mail.

If MHDSM provided four immunities, it'd be one of the best armors in the game.

[miyazaki]

The 5 resistances plus activation for magical resistance would still make a damn fine armour, without being over the top. It would be awesome for warriors. I think immunities should stay on artifacts only.

[Ycombinator]

I like the idea of element immunities from DSM very much. As it was already pointed out, MHDSM and PDSM giving only resistances is somewhat inconsistent with this proposal, but four immunities will make them vastly overpowered. I think we can live with inconsistency.

[Pete Mack]

@fyonn--
that's way too powerful for the basic 4 (or GDSM, or MHDSM). I've worn MHDSM in a couple games, and occasionally wear basic 4 early in the game for AC, elemental resist, and a big initial attack. (This makes sense only if armor is costed according to power, not according to "cost" in object.txt; in that case, ~25K GP is always better than the benefits from elemental DSM.)

My recommendation: get rid of the really useless DSMs and bronze DSM, and add RConf to many (all?) of the remaining non-elemental DSMs. (Gold and above.) That would leave Green DSM with rPois (and possibly activation for resist poison), blue dsm with activation for resist electricity, MHDSM (with possible activation for Restistance.)

It wouldn't unbalance the game, because DSM is already fairly rare, and rConf is bog standard for standart armor artifacts. And it would make DSM be more likely to be useful as something other than an easy 25K from the armory.

[Philip]

Why not give WhiteDSM frostbrand capability and such? I don't what with the other DSM's.

[fyonn]

Why not give WhiteDSM frostbrand capability and such? I don't what with the other DSM's.

well, then presumable Red, Blue, Black and Green DSM would get fire, shock, acid and venom branding (and matching resistances).. and MHDSM get all four..

not a bad idea. I also like the idea of DSM's having ResFear. surely no-one should be scared when wearing armour made from a dragon!

not sure about the other non-elemental DSM's, but there has been talk of other brands such as light, dark and nether...

In my head it seems like DSM should be worth wearing. I know it's heavy and that's fine, but surely only really good armour should be worth wearing over DSM, unless the weight is an issue of course...

dave