Breaking Into Vaults

[Whelk]

I got to a vault today that's shaped like an arrow pointing at a target on the inside. I can't for the life of me tunnel in. I found a tunnellable spot, but have spent thousands of turns unsuccessfully tunneling. I don't have any stone-to-mud ability, and no digger items. The best I figure I have is a 19-pound glaive I found lying around.

Am I going to have to let this vault pass me by? Not that I'd be too bummed, since I found 3 artifacts without even entering the vault - they were lying around outside.

- The Soft Leather Armor 'Hithlomir'
- The Cloak of Thorongil
- Un-IDed {special} gauntlets (probably those ones that activate for fire bolt)

Is it hopeless to try to break into a doorless vault without stone-to-mud or a digger? Guess I should have bought that Ring of Delving after all.

[Zikke]

Sometimes you can Phase Door into a vault after a few tries.

I believe the walls have a finite amount of "durability points" that if you tunnel against it long enough it will break. I'm not a developer though, so this might not be true.

[Whelk]

I just amazed myself with my own ingenuity. I lured an umber hulk to the stubborn wall, maneuvered around it (thanks to its having eaten away a lot of the surrounding corridor) and hit it light enough to scare it off, but not kill it. In its attempt to flee, it burrowed right through the wall I couldn't tunnel through.

Now to see if I end up dying for all that effort (which I probably will). I did at least find a wand of Teleport Other earlier in the level, which should be helpful.

[Donald Jonker]

I just amazed myself with my own ingenuity. I lured an umber hulk to the stubborn wall, maneuvered around it (thanks to its having eaten away a lot of the surrounding corridor) and hit it light enough to scare it off, but not kill it. In its attempt to flee, it burrowed right through the wall I couldn't tunnel through.

Now to see if I end up dying for all that effort (which I probably will). I did at least find a wand of Teleport Other earlier in the level, which should be helpful.

Bravo! I don't think Zikke's techniques actually work. Phase door/teleport I'm pretty certain won't get you in (maybe it does in some variants), and IIRC, in newer versions of Vanilla, only diggers can get through granite... or maybe acid branded weapons as well?

[PowerDiver]

IIRC, in newer versions of Vanilla, only diggers can get through granite... or maybe acid branded weapons as well?

That would be a big change. I thought that STR 18/70 or so with a moderately heavy weapon is enough to dig granite, albeit slowly.

[Big Al]

That would be a big change. I thought that STR 18/70 or so with a moderately heavy weapon is enough to dig granite, albeit slowly.

I debug-mode char with 18/70 and a board sword is capable of digging granite with the latest build...

[Donald Jonker]

I debug-mode char with 18/70 and a board sword is capable of digging granite with the latest build...

Woops.. my apologies then for offering faulty advice. I have a memory of inspecting a giant weapon and being informed that it didn't affect granite. Must have been a blunt weapon?

I'll admit I have no intuitive understanding of breakpoints b/w weapons and digging. I suppose at least that information is offered now on inspection..

I assumed that strength affected how long it takes on average to dig through a given substance, but not whether it's possible - is this the case?

[PowerDiver]

IIRC, you compare something like (wall adjust + 1d1600) to (str adjust + weight adjust + digging adjust). Lots of values to look up.

[Pete Mack]

Phase/Teleport won't work, but blink dogs will. In NPP, the blink dogs will do you the favor of blinking out of the vault to say hi, and then blinking you in.

[Mondkalb]

Bravo! I don't think Zikke's techniques actually work. Phase door/teleport I'm pretty certain won't get you in (maybe it does in some variants), and IIRC, in newer versions of Vanilla, only diggers can get through granite... or maybe acid branded weapons as well?

It was possible to phase into vaults if the surrounding area had been destructed with destruction/earthquake. I haven't tested this with newer versions though.

[PaulBlay]

It was possible to phase into vaults if the surrounding area had been destructed with destruction/earthquake.

Speaking purely from a theoretical viewpoint, that can happen because the actual 'vault area' is a rectangle - possibly rather larger than the 'pretty bit'. You are actually using phase-door from inside the vault area even if it isn't immediately obvious.

[Daniel Fishman]

Speaking purely from a theoretical viewpoint, that can happen because the actual 'vault area' is a rectangle - possibly rather larger than the 'pretty bit'. You are actually using phase-door from inside the vault area even if it isn't immediately obvious.

But doesn't phase from inside a vault always lands you outside it, even if the normal range of the teleport cannot get you to land outside it?

[PaulBlay]

But doesn't phase from inside a vault always lands you outside it, even if the normal range of the teleport cannot get you to land outside it?

I think that depends on variant. I don't know about vanilla in particular.

[Mondkalb]

I think that depends on variant. I don't know about vanilla in particular.

In Vanilla phase door takes you outside the vault.