Stat Gain in the Mid-Game - Preferred Approach?

[fentesk]

What are the main recommendations for bumping stats mid-game?
- What dungeon levels will you typically explore for potions (if at all)?
- Are there standard targets that you want to be at (e.g., damage per round, HP, AC, etc.) before going passed certain points?

I'm a slow diver and I'm sure I "should" be deeper. I'm ready to head down to 1500+ to start accumulating stat potions (which seem to have been greatly reduced from showing up in the black market).

http://angband.oook.cz/ladder-show.php?id=25369

[sffp]

Wow. You've got a lot of stuff.

You're carrying your Rod of Disable Traps but leaving your wand of Teleport Other at home?

Actually, the Slow and Detection are end game items while you're other three rods are junk
potions of cure (light/serious/crit) are better than the rod of curing because rods fail and potions do not

scrolls of recall are better because sometimes you change your mind and want to stay so you can read a second scroll to "un"recall


There's no set depth for damage to dive, nor even speed.
Your @ is overqualified to be in the sweet 1700-1900 range to pick up stat gain potions which will of course, raise your weapon damage with more hits per round.

[fentesk]

Thanks for the response and the info on the stat potion sweet spot.

I carry one TO wand with me, and have a second stored in the house just in case there is something that can nuke both of them. (Though with my play style, I don't get much use from TO, yet).

Stat loss drives me crazy, and this version of Angband makes it harder than I remember to get your stats back, so I bring the Disable Traps for things that hit STR/DEX. He is *terrible* as disabling traps on treasure chests.

I have been meaning to get rid of the Curing Rods. My last character used them a lot, but he also didn't have Confusion or Poison RES by this point, and I got used to them. The failure rate is ridiculously high for this character, so they're really not helping me.

The game is taunting me, I hit a 4-9 level, but the big thing was Mithril Plate of Resistance [60,+13], which would be awesome except I already have Full Plate of Elvenkind [62, +11] with Nether RES.

After some recent finds, I need to decide if +2 Speed (for a total of +4) and Confusion RES is worth doing half damage (Totila vs. Lotherang).

- When uploading an updated character dump, do you just enter it like a new one, or is there a way to do it from the existing ladder link?

[sffp]

It will overwrite your previous @
I don't know how to enter it as a new one.

There's obviously a difference between +2 and +4 speed.
Resist confusion is really good.
I would stick with Totilla for now.

[ewert]

You can prime yourself for statgain with the swap potions by forcing a stat over 18 where a single point gives 20-30 or so, then your next stat while maintaining the one over 18 at 18 or over. I usually save all my swap potions at home while going for dlvl30 for that purpose. Depending on class that can make your statgain much simpler as you hit multiple hits etc.

As for actual stat gain, if you are weak you can farm 30-31, I tend to like packs of humanoids/humanoid monsters for killing, otherwise just exploring. If you are a bit stronger, lvl 40-41 for a small chance of augmentations (IIRC it is 40 still). If doing it at 40, there are chances of quick deaths already if you are a low HP char like Kavlax.

If you ever want to try slightly more aggressive way, you can just get a bit of str/dex or int or wis to get either melee dmg or casting dmg up, and then just carefully descend all the way to 60, where I feel the gains are way higher but you are still bit less likely to be swamped by too tough stuff all the time.

Some say 90 isn't more dangerous than 60 since you can die quickly at 60 too, but the likelyhood of being able to get stuff done and loot stuff at 60 is way better. 90 after a quick dive tends to be just insanely chock full of uniques and tough stuff ...

[fentesk]

Is there a general view of what "low HP" means for DL40?

< 200?
200?
300?
400+?

Thoughts on AC and speed targets for melee characters (particularly Blackguard) would be appreciated as well (or if these types of questions are compiled in a guide I've missed, let me know!)

It's been 15+ years (and many versions) since I've taken a character out for a spin. Thanks all!

[sffp]

Kavlax breathes 1 times in 4 (on average), moves quickly and does 200 points of gravity (216 chaos/nexus/sound/nexus/shards) damage.

The best strategy against Kavlax is to not be in the same room with Kavlax until you've got the speed drop and ~600 HP. Or a fabulous distance attack and a line of sight advantage.

[Sky]

Kavlax is one of those uniques that is either a joke or a murderer, so, just better to leave him alone until you got a whoooole lot of resistances.
Same for Gorlim, and his ******** water (stun) bolts.

Angband in general is a game of "yeeeah, MAYBE NO". Being a coward is a useful evolutionary trait.

[Estie]

I have often attempted Kavlax when I had ~300 hp, +10 base speed and a speed potion to spare; it hasnt always worked but if he doesnt spam gravity and other nasty breaths, his low health pool makes him an easy kill.

[sffp]

Oh yeah, he's definitely doable.
Just like a Greater Baselisk without rPoi if you have a cold attack.

I just don't recommend it.

[fentesk]

Thanks for the notes! Anyone else that I should be particularly on the lookout for?

I'm hanging out at 2000', maxed STR and DEX and have everything at least to 18 (self).

Gorlim and Kavlax are no longer a concern for this character (though had I seen the above before I may not have risked them).

Part of my "slow and steady" approach is spamming Staves of Summoning (with the Cloak of Thingol to recharge) so that I can pull up uniques and fight them one-on-one.

Kavlax went down pretty easily in melee and it appears never breathed on me (part of my "summoning kit" is the Blackguard taunting spell, which I assume had something to do with that.) Gorlim I needed to teleport away from and come back to finish off as he had no trouble lobbing serious wounds, water bolts, and mana bolts at me over and over.

The closest fight so far was with Waldern who I also needed to go away and lick my wounds and come back to and still was a close battle.

[Ingwe Ingweron]

As far as the original question, once I get free action and a reasonable small damage output, I dive as fast as possible until DL 30, and then proceed more slowly, searching for stat gain potions and upgrades, as well as targets of opportunity. If I can get stats up pretty high, and can find some speed and some ESP by about DL 50 or 60, I am pretty happy and dive all the way for DL98, hopefully using Deep Descent. Once there, I again sneak and search around for upgrades and careful battles with targets of opportunity. Eventually, if @ can survive long enough, I'll have enough hit points, stats, resists, protections, equipment, damage output, and speed to take on the Big Bosses. Then I just go for it.

[Sky]

Is there a general view of what "low HP" means for DL40?

not really. If you are a mage, you can pretty much decide exactly what you are going to fight, and HP dont matter if mobs cant hit you.
Otherwise, "enough hp" is situational. If you are a warrior and you could be face to face with a drolem, then maybe 600hp is mandatory. You need to be aware of what you are about to fight and be ready for it. I died with a mage @ 500hp because i forgot to put up Resistance and got breathed on by Gothmog for 1/3 of 1600 fire damage ..

[fentesk]

Awesome, thanks for the suggestions! Sadly, speed (+4) and ESP seem to be the main things I'm lacking at the moment, but I'm sure they'll come around.

[kineahora]

Kavlax is one of those uniques that is either a joke or a murderer, so, just better to leave him alone until you got a whoooole lot of resistances.
Same for Gorlim, and his ******** water (stun) bolts.

Angband in general is a game of "yeeeah, MAYBE NO". Being a coward is a useful evolutionary trait.

I always avoid Kavlax and Gorlim when trying for stat gain aggressively with a weak char.

I like stat gaining around DLevel 34 because gravity hounds are native to DLevel 35. Dracoliches I think are DLevel 40-ish yes?

I would say commonest deaths are gravity hounds and Kavlax... Also impact hounds and death knights are to be given respect.