First Time Winning Angband

[DavidMedley]

Mostly, Im annoyed that the class that seems like it should be the *least* dependent on the town is in fact the *most* dependent.

This is an interesting point

[archolewa]

this is what you do to win with a mage.

I have gotten to the endgame with a mage, before getting offed by Wiruin, but honestly I just dont enjoy the class much. I find scumming to be boring, and that seems to be what mages are good at, and I dont like being within one-shot range of everything all the time. Mass Banishing a vault is fun the first time, but gets old the seventh.

Generally, when a mage detects, they look for monsters they can kill, and avoid everything else. I prefer to play classes where you use detect to find monsters to avoid, and can kill everything else (whether you do or not is up to you).

[Pete Mack]

Hanging at DL 40 Atil CL 35 isn't exactly powerdiving. Without (e.g.) midgame U to pick off, it'll take a looong time.

[SonicSpeedBryce]

this is what you do to win with mage.

Get a mage to DL35/40.
Pump him full of stat potions.
2x rings of Escaping
stash all the !Enlight and ?DD you find.

when you get to CL35 circa (10% TO fail or lower) read all the scrolls of DD you have and get to DL96+, find stairs and keep scumming until you get a LF 8.

use !Enlightment and look for a Kelek's. Teleport away everything that stands between you and Keleks.

Learn banish. Banish everything and pick up gear.
Drink potions of !Exp

Once you are CL50 find morgoth and mana storm him into nothingness.

That sounds like a cool speedrunning/powerdiving strategy! My playthrough was much less interesting, though. I made decent progress through the dungeon until I hit points that I felt I needed better gear/certain resists in order to survive, say, a surprise capped poison breath. Reveal Monsters/Detection and Teleport Other helped to mitigate such risks, but I still didn't want to take any chances.

When I got Wizard's Tome of Power, I just started spamming Banishment and Mass Banishment to get rid of the non-uniques that I didn't want to deal with, and only engaged Uniques that I felt I could take on. At DL97 and DL98, I just started grinding those, getting experience and extra consumables along the way, hoping to find an artifact that had all resists on it (namely Bladeturner) so that I could resist anything that Morgoth could throw at me.

I never found Bladeturner, but I did find The One Ring, which was close enough for my purposes. After tens of thousands of turns later of searching and a near death experience with some dragon that nearly one shot me, I finally decided to just face Sauron and Morgoth. In retrospect, they were surprisingly easy. The gear I used covered resists nicely while supplying the status protections I cared about. The summons were no issue because of the whole Banishment/Mass Banishment thing, as well as the fact that I offed all the other uniques beforehand.

I think, in the future, I'll play another High-Elf Mage and see how well the powerdiving strategy works.

[Sky]

I still havent won with a mage.

Regardless, congratulations! That first win is something special.

this is what you do to win with mage.

Get a mage to DL35/40.
Pump him full of stat potions.
2x rings of Escaping
stash all the !Enlight and ?DD you find.

when you get to CL35 circa (10% TO fail or lower) read all the scrolls of DD you have and get to DL96+, find stairs and keep scumming until you get a LF 8.

use !Enlightment and look for a Kelek's. Teleport away everything that stands between you and Keleks.

Learn banish. Banish everything and pick up gear.
Drink potions of !Exp

Once you are CL50 find morgoth and mana storm him into nothingness.

[archolewa]

Their melee is better than it used to be, and they also have good stealth. So they're meant to be more like a rogue than anything else, really.

I just experimented a bit, and it looks like they can hit 2 blows per round to start (at least a Dunadan), however you have to tweak the default point buy a bit. I was under the mistaken impression that you couldnt hit 2 blows. Ill have to try again some time, and see if starting with 2 blows changes my opinion any.

[Julian]

This I would totally be down with. That or just giving them a better blows table. They are a hybrid class, I feel like they should be better at melee. I think you could give them the same blows table as the paladin without losing anything. A paladins healing still means they are better in melee than a Ranger. But this way Rangers actually have some means of offense wothout having to recall to buy more arrows every other floor. Or give them a table that is generous early, but much more stingy later. So by the midgame they are lagging hard behind warriors in melee, but in the early game they arent a priest without any healing spells.

The blows calculation doesn’t work like that. Except by capping the maximum number of blows, you can’t make a class get extra blows early and not still be good later.

[Nick]

This I would totally be down with. That or just giving them a better blows table. They are a hybrid class, I feel like they should be better at melee. I think you could give them the same blows table as the paladin without losing anything. A paladins healing still means they are better in melee than a Ranger. But this way Rangers actually have some means of offense wothout having to recall to buy more arrows every other floor. Or give them a table that is generous early, but much more stingy later. So by the midgame they are lagging hard behind warriors in melee, but in the early game they arent a priest without any healing spells.

Their melee is better than it used to be, and they also have good stealth. So they're meant to be more like a rogue than anything else, really.

[archolewa]

Maybe it'd be good if Rangers had two make arrows spells. The high level one they have now, and a low level one which only makes average arrows.

This I would totally be down with. That or just giving them a better blows table. They are a hybrid class, I feel like they should be better at melee. I think you could give them the same blows table as the paladin without losing anything. A paladins healing still means they are better in melee than a Ranger. But this way Rangers actually have some means of offense wothout having to recall to buy more arrows every other floor. Or give them a table that is generous early, but much more stingy later. So by the midgame they are lagging hard behind warriors in melee, but in the early game they arent a priest without any healing spells.

[Nick]

Doesn't a lantern of shadows need fuel to keep it's antilight active?

Yes, it does.

[will_asher]

Thats true. I guess to me Rangers are in a bit of an awkward spot. Most of their spells really shine when you play without a town, but they are *so* reliant on arrows, and arrows are *so* rare in the dungeon that you end up either playing with a lot of spells that are at best conveniences, or where you have to carefully ration the only offense at which you shine. I know they eventually get a spell that lets them turn staves into arrows, but that doesn't help early.

Mostly, Im annoyed that the class that seems like it should be the *least* dependent on the town is in fact the *most* dependent.

Maybe it'd be good if Rangers had two make arrows spells. The high level one they have now, and a low level one which only makes average arrows.

[Pete Mack]

Doesn't a lantern of shadows need fuel to keep it's antilight active?

[sffp]

Oh. It appears that the Necromancer and Blackguard classes are much more complicated than I first thought.

Maybe I should try a different class for now. Maybe a Ranger?

Oh don't let me stop you

I have a ton of fun playing my hopping kobold necs
I finally have one to legendary stealth so there's a chance at victory.

The real issue is so few hp's in a kobold so ultra-fragile

[sffp]

Until you get the make arrow spell
"I don't know what this staff does, but it makes some mighty fine arrows"
Me quoting me

[archolewa]

@archo
Rangers have one excellent early spell: Resist poison. And detect life is a good, especially when backed up with a Staff of detect evil.

Thats true. I guess to me Rangers are in a bit of an awkward spot. Most of their spells really shine when you play without a town, but they are *so* reliant on arrows, and arrows are *so* rare in the dungeon that you end up either playing with a lot of spells that are at best conveniences, or where you have to carefully ration the only offense at which you shine. I know they eventually get a spell that lets them turn staves into arrows, but that doesn't help early.

Mostly, Im annoyed that the class that seems like it should be the *least* dependent on the town is in fact the *most* dependent.