Buggy mimic

[jens]

Furthermore, this is already my preferred way of dealing with mimics. I carry around spikes in the early levels just to throw them at copper coins. Should this tactic be encouraged?

If your point is that it becomes tedious to do this all the time, then I do not have a problem with it. Mimics are harmless enough that I can't see that tactic being 'optimal', leading to many people adopting it. On the other hand I'd like to see mimics become tougher, so getting surprised by them at the wrong moment would mean something.

[EpicMan]

Mimics seem pretty common in Roguelikes, here are some IMHO interesting things Mimics can do in other games:

The Mimics in Crawl can teleport away if they are badly hurt and re-mimic as a different item, so you don't know what they will look like anymore.

In ADoM when mimics reveal themselves they become green 'm's. They also have a chance of paralyzing you, making meleeing them very dangerous. The worst mimics, Mimic Hiveminds, can also summon *more* mimics.

The Crawl method makes mimics dangerous more than once, and makes the player sweat a bit if one gets away, since the player no longer knows what the mimic looks like. Combining that with the ADOM paralyzing attacks might be too harsh, however. Then again, with paralyzing attacks being less of an instakill now it might not be.

I do like the idea of a deep mimic that can summon other mimics, it makes running into one a hairy situation.

[Derakon]

Then again, with paralyzing attacks being less of an instakill now it might not be.

Since the change to make paralysis attacks non-cumulative, I've had one character survive getting paralyzed when there was an awake monster in the area. I've probably lost at least ten to lacking free action, since I'm a) terrible about remembering who can paralyze, and b) unwilling to postpone diving just so I can get some gear with FA.

In short, paralysis may be less of an instakill than it used to be, but that's because we reduced it from a briefcase nuke to a grenade.

[camlost]

Mimics seem pretty common in Roguelikes, here are some IMHO interesting things Mimics can do in other games:

The Mimics in Crawl can teleport away if they are badly hurt and re-mimic as a different item, so you don't know what they will look like anymore.

In ADoM when mimics reveal themselves they become green 'm's. They also have a chance of paralyzing you, making meleeing them very dangerous. The worst mimics, Mimic Hiveminds, can also summon *more* mimics.

The Crawl method makes mimics dangerous more than once, and makes the player sweat a bit if one gets away, since the player no longer knows what the mimic looks like. Combining that with the ADOM paralyzing attacks might be too harsh, however. Then again, with paralyzing attacks being less of an instakill now it might not be.

I do like the idea of a deep mimic that can summon other mimics, it makes running into one a hairy situation.

This feels so much like Sangband, it hurts.

[Max Stats]

The worst mimics, Mimic Hiveminds, can also summon *more* mimics.

Something like this would be a chest mimic containing smaller mimics, or just random small monsters.

[Derakon]

Rather than a chest mimic containing other mimics, shouldn't bog-standard chests contain mimics? I mean, you don't open chest mimics as it currently stands.

[CunningGabe]

If your point is that it becomes tedious to do this all the time, then I do not have a problem with it.

Agreed. The whole point is that you should be careful knowing that items can be mimics, and Angband is a game of careful preparation. Besides, I find it funny to imagine the character throwing things at money on the ground to see if it says "ow"

I kind of think of mimics as a better version of traps. They provide some small threat if you're not careful, but you don't have to constantly detect for them. A mimic alone will almost never kill a player -- but when you try to grab that potion of healing while fleeing something nasty, ...

[Nomad]

I'd love to hear any and all other mimic ideas -- including ideas for new mimics or lurkers. I'm hoping to add some new ones in 3.4.0.

For a bit of variety, how about door, staircase and rubble mimics?

And for the higher levels, mimics that take the shape of high level weapons - blades of chaos, maces of disruption, scythes of slicing - should tempt most players over. And could do a lot of damage if they have the same attack dice as their base weapon.

[jens]

For a bit of variety, how about door, staircase and rubble mimics?

And for the higher levels, mimics that take the shape of high level weapons - blades of chaos, maces of disruption, scythes of slicing - should tempt most players over. And could do a lot of damage if they have the same attack dice as their base weapon.

I don't like the idea of any feature possibly being a mimic. It's nice to have to be on the lookout once in a while, but to be wary all the time gets old...

[Derakon]

Also keep in mind that any monster that mimics a given item type should be significantly more rare than the item itself. You don't want 80% (or even 30%) of Blades of Chaos to be mimics, because their ability to blend in and surprise the player gets compromised.

[CunningGabe]

For a bit of variety, how about door, staircase and rubble mimics?

I've been thinking of this too, and the hard part is making sure the mimic is in a convincing place. A door mimic out in the middle of a room isn't going to fool *too* many people

[camlost]

I've been thinking of this too, and the hard part is making sure the mimic is in a convincing place. A door mimic out in the middle of a room isn't going to fool *too* many people

To do this, you simply need to change doors (or rubble) into mimics -- then they'll be in the correct place.

[CunningGabe]

To do this, you simply need to change doors (or rubble) into mimics -- then they'll be in the correct place.

That's true, but it requires some finesse. I don't want to just randomly change some features into feature mimics -- I want feature mimics to obey as many of the usual monster placement rules as possible.

[d_m]

I'm not sure feature mimics (other than maybe stairs) are a great idea. I *do* like making more kinds of mimics (e.g animated weapons, armor golems, etc) as well as maybe a unique mimic and/or animated artifact.

As far as "mimics being better traps" I agree with that also. The current hidden traps/trap-detection minigame is really boring and uninteresting. If traps were always visible but hard to disarm (and also possibly more deadly) I think the game would be much better for it.

[bulian]

I'm not sure feature mimics (other than maybe stairs) are a great idea.

Stair mimics would just be cruel. Please don't. I don't think stair mimics make sense anyway, as all other suggested items are solids, whereas staircases are more of a passage.