Competition 63

[andrewdoull]

Well competition 63 appears to be conclusively won, and no one has posted any new entries in a while. Should we start 64 early?

Andrew

[Nick]

Well competition 63 appears to be conclusively won, and no one has posted any new entries in a while. Should we start 64 early?

I'm glad you asked, because this and related questions have been bugging me for a while.

The current comp outlook is this:

• 63 is scheduled to finish on the 11th of Feb, to be followed by an NPP 0.5.0 comp. Jeff tells me 0.5.0 final should be done by then; clearly anyone who believes a maintainer's word on deadlines is a fool, but takkaria actually met his for 3.1.0, so who knows.
• I have promised chem an Entro comp (although Entro is officially dead, he is planning a new, similar variant based on V3.1.0 and wants feedback).
• FA 0.3.6 will be out soon (I hear ), and I would like to run a comp for that.
• Z+ has had one recently, but is also in very active development.
• Portralis has never had one, and clearly should.
• There has been at least one request for V comps to be fairly frequent.
• None of Un, S, Steam or Iron have had one for a while.
• And then there's always ToME, Fury, etc - how do people feel about those (be frank)?
• I have undoubtedly ignored and offended at least one person (by not mentioning Hellband, for example).

So, with that context, I have some questions:

1. Should comps be cut short when they appear finished? This may be a problem for people (and I know of at least one) who don't get to oook regularly, but do read rgra.
2. Should we run multiple comps at once? (I know, I've asked this before)
3. If so, when? Should they start together, or offset? Should I start a new one when the last one appears done? How many at once is feasible? (I know, that's more than one question).

I'd like as many opinions expressed as possible (even if it's just "whatever").

I'd like to say, too, that it's much nicer to be in the situation of having too many potential comps than too few.

[Donald Jonker]

[/LIST]

So, with that context, I have some questions:

1. Should comps be cut short when they appear finished? This may be a problem for people (and I know of at least one) who don't get to oook regularly, but do read rgra.
2. Should we run multiple comps at once? (I know, I've asked this before)
3. If so, when? Should they start together, or offset? Should I start a new one when the last one appears done? How many at once is feasible? (I know, that's more than one question).

I think we should start a new one up when there's been a somewhat conclusive winner rather than prematurely end the old one. As unlikely as it seems, there's always the possibility of a new champion lurking in our midst... So I think two at once at most.

I'd like to start a new comp - NPP preferably.. it seems done - maybe bogged down by the problem that you can never cross the room because first you have to go half way, and then go half the remaining distance, and half that remaining distance, and so on... I was thinking it would be cool if the comp rules stipulated you had to take the hardest quest each time or something like that.

But if playing Entro will get fresh development on it someday, well by golly I think that's worth fighting for.

Steam would be alright.. it's a great variant, but its lack of balance often bums me out, same with Hellband. But maybe a comp would likewise motivate their respective maintainers.

Portralis would be interesting as well.

[Atarlost]

I think running concurrent comps is a good idea, but I don't have an opinion as to whether they should be synchronized or staggered. I do think one should always be of a stable variant. I'm not inclined to get involved in guinea pig comps like the current V 3.1 comp, but would consider playing one based on a variant for which I don't see a bug report on the forum every couple days.

Actually I'd go a little farther than that. I think there should be two competition tracks, a serious *bander track that does betas and challenge charachters and a casual *bander track that does variants that don't have sharp edges or loose ends and charachters that won't excessively frustrate a casual gamer. I also think that at least for the casual *bander oriented competitions you should mix up birth options. For instance I prefer preserve mode and won't touch disconnected stairs. One casual track competition out of four should have those birth options set the way I like.

I'd also recommend avoiding ToME. As much as I like it it's not suitable for competitions because of the turncount exploits. If you know them you can level up very quickly in the wilderness. Because of this any ToME competition would have to have victory conditions completely unrelated to turncount to avoid penalizing people who play it straight.

[Bodkin]

I like the idea of starting a new one, while allowing the old one to remain open until its deadline has arrived. I guess that makes me a "concurrentist," but I don't favor keeping more than one line of competitions; if there's a second competition open, it should only be the previous one, waiting its turn for retirement but keeping its promised deadline while the regulars turn their attention to the new one. Otherwise you'll end up with dilution of talent within each comp, and the winner might wonder how much of an achievement his victory really is. (I don't imagine I'll ever be in that position, so I'll wonder vicariously.)

[buzzkill]

Don't cut the competition short. A clear cut winner and no recent posts doesn't necessarily mean that no one is playing a competition character. Personally, I don't play with the expectation or goal of winning. I know that I'm not that good. I just like to see how high I can get on the ladder, and because of my slow play style, it may take me weeks to better my currently posted character (that means weeks without posting).

[Big Al]

I don't think it would hurt to start a new comp, without changing the old deadline. Still allow a few last minute entries to trickle in, but might as well start a new one since we're unlikely to get a new winner.

[Rizwan]

I think we should start a new one up when there's been a somewhat conclusive winner rather than prematurely end the old one. As unlikely as it seems, there's always the possibility of a new champion lurking in our midst... .

I was thinking the exact same thing ... start a new one when the previous one appears to have finished but dont end the competition before the due date.

So I think two at once at most.

Not quite in agreement on that one ... leave it open to have as many sequentially concurrent competitions as possible ... realistically speaking though you may be right there probably wont be enough time to have more than two

A suggestion on competition characters ... how about taking them from the angband ladder (the dead ones I mean not the winners)?

[darkdrone]

Trying to upload my 63 char fails

"
The Angband Ladder - reading your character...

reading chardump, please wait...
error!! is this really character dump?"

get that while trying to upload the Comp 63 Angband 3.1.0 chardump... what am i doing wrong ?

the savefile is just named "63" the way i downloaded it.

*EDIT* Another Reason why playing Angband with 2 hours of sleep in 72 hours is BAD

*EDIT 2* You Smite the Green Horned Horror of Real Life
- Green Horned Horror of Real Life summons The Laughing Demons of Newbieness
- You Smite the Green Horned Horror of Real Life
- The Green Horned Horror of Real Life Dies -
- Laughing Demons of Newbieness breathe Embarrassment
- you die

[pav]

You're uploading a savefile? You need to upload the dump!

[darkdrone]

You're uploading a savefile? You need to upload the dump!

AAARGH ... i think that last glass was Green Speckled Potion of Lose Memories ....

too much Real Life not enough Angbanding , that should teach me!

thanks Pav

[Nick]

AAARGH ... i think that last glass was Green Speckled Potion of Lose Memories ....

No, your memory is fine. Prior to comp 61, the thing to do was send in a savefile at the end of the comp. When pav started hosting them here at 61, it changed to posting a dump to the special ladder (although emailing me a savefile is still OK if you have some issue with posting dumps).

[Nick]

I don't think it would hurt to start a new comp, without changing the old deadline. Still allow a few last minute entries to trickle in, but might as well start a new one since we're unlikely to get a new winner.

This seems to be the consensus. Since the new NPP is not done yet, I'm inclined to go with Entro. I'll be away for a few days; if someone can send me a savefile in that time, I'll start the new comp on the 1st or 2nd of Feb.

[Nick]

Congratulations to evariste on another comp win, and to drchung and ShieTar (and evariste again) for getting a game win.