Halls of Mist is here!

[buzzkill]

Maybe Alertness shouldn't grant AC bonus at all, but bigger bonuses to trap detection and saving throw. I'd like it more if it was an option for special situations, not an automatic play.

Agreed. I'll tune it down.

Really. Has it changed since Fay? I'll agree that getting diseased and not being able to cure it sucks, but the potion only cost like 30 GP. Even my terminally impoverished templar can afford that. I know that I would always have a means of cure disease with me in Fay. That's just the way it was.

I'd much rather see a potion of cure disease in the home of every CL1 character (as a hint) than see disease get nerfed. The whole disease mechanic is very cool and can be very serious (though not fatal) or very trivial depending on your preparation. I think it plays well that way.

[buzzkill]

Highborn isn't a race, it's a social class. Most persons from Skultgard are humans.

Yeah, fire/ice bolts would be more interesting...

Yeah, the angry townfolk lose thier bite pretty quickly. Do they ever scale up?

[Mikko Lehtinen]

Yeah, the angry townfolk lose thier bite pretty quickly. Do they ever scale up?

Not at the moment.

[Aiel117]

An Ancient Tome?

First, awesome variant. I've played quite a few, and this is one of the first real tactical and strategic games in a while

Second, I just got an Ancient Tome, and I'm guessing it's a left over from EyAngband? Should it have a ritual associated with it like other magic books?

[Satyr]

I just got an Ancient Tome, and I'm guessing it's a left over from EyAngband? Should it have a ritual associated with it like other magic books?

It's an artefact book, so you might have to *identify* it first.

[nppangband]

In terms of interface, where does NPP stack? I've a feeling it's up there with v4, V3.4 and FA.

I'd like to play them all. Apart from interface ideas, I'm hunting for interesting monsters.

It should have almost everything V3.4 has in terms of user interface. NPP does not yet have UTF-8 characters or the shockbolt (64x64) tileset, and it still have old-style macros, but other than that the interface should be similar with the current V.

[Aiel117]

Killed the Duke

I killed the Thin White Duke. But, I only did it by having multiple saves. I died three times on the way, so I won't upload the character.

What I can say is that it is possible to kill him, given the right luck. Speed items are incredibly important, and finding a weapon with light brand helps, because almost all monsters will become blind. I used a double flail of day from level 15 to 42.

It was a little frustrating to get almost no artifacts until the end. I'd prefer a steady pace of artifacts from level 1 to the end, rather than going from 0 to competing artifacts for the same slot.

Agreed that the early levels are a bit tedious. I'd spice it up with more monsters, or tougher mid-range monsters. Even beating the game, I was only level 40, and I played a human ranger. There's no way some of the other classes will come close to level 50 and using their end game spells. So, either experience needs to be much easier to get, especially late game, or the spell levels need to be lowered so as to be useful at some point.

Only reasons I could survive in the end game: Absorb Hit and boots of speed +8.

Archery, sadly, was mostly underwhelming. There was a short period with a long bow and silver/iron arrows that it was decent, but then the real hurt items, seeker arrows or hunter's lore branded arrows, came way too late. Could there perhaps be a ritual that would yield arrows?

Also, WIS+MEM greater than 40+ never happened. I would imagine it almost never does.

My suggestion: why not have multiple proficiencies based on stats? WIS+MEM = either +saving throw or identify. STR+CON = berserk or resist/cure disease. DEX+PRE = +ac or intimidation. Since this variant is all about the stats, it would keep the player focused on increasing them, and making careful balancing decisions, at all times.

Going to try again without cheating. Still one of the best variants I've played, and really looking forward to where it's going!

[Mikko Lehtinen]

I'm glad you like the game. Good to see that The Duke is actually killable. I haven't ever won the game myself.

Thanks for the very useful comments. I've collected lots of good player feedback for the upcoming rebalancing work.

My suggestion: why not have multiple proficiencies based on stats? WIS+MEM = either +saving throw or identify. STR+CON = berserk or resist/cure disease. DEX+PRE = +ac or intimidation. Since this variant is all about the stats, it would keep the player focused on increasing them, and making careful balancing decisions, at all times.

I've actually considered something like this. But I'm afraid that keeping track of the combined score of two stats isn't actually that much fun. I'd rather move in the opposite direction really...

In future versions I'm planning to experiment with identifying objects with successful Alchemy skill checks. Everybody has two attempts (Identify points) per dungeon level. In a Circle of Knowledge you may instead try to (i)dentify pack or to (f)ully identify an object, both requiring Alchemy checks -- one for each identified item.

Some details are still open, like Alertness and the Templar's proficiencies. Perhaps they would use the same points -- we could call them Mind points -- and require Perception checks?

[Arjen]

It's an artefact book, so you might have to *identify* it first.

I did *id* it once, but it only gave me "it resists the elements" description. I didn't had a clue what to do with those books.

[Mikko Lehtinen]

I did *id* it once, but it only gave me "it resists the elements" description. I didn't had a clue what to do with those books.

That's a bug. *Id* should reveal the ritual. What was the name of the book?

[Arjen]

I've no idea... It wasn't with my last char I found it.

[Mikko Lehtinen]

I've no idea... It wasn't with my last char I found it.

Ok! I'll check every artifact book then. Thanks for finding another bug.

[Mikko Lehtinen]

Actually there are just two artifacts books in the game: The Necronomicon and Mathemagical Calculations. I *Identified* them, and both reveal their rituals when inspected.

I see two possibilities:

Perhaps the third artifact book that I've commented out in the artifact.txt, The Codex of Ultimate Wisdom, is still getting generated somehow.

Or perhaps you tried to Analyse Item for *Identification* but failed the Perception skill roll?

[getter77]

As expected:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N_7LC0LZeOI&

Should be a good window into the reckonings of a new player into the game that had only touched on a bit of Angband before but a good many other Roguelikes outright.

[buzzkill]

Boring!

My second game of Mist played entirely different from my first, and not in a good way. While my templar struggled, earning every bit of dungeon and nearly died on every level (and was a hell of a lot of fun to play), my current mage, the supposedly fragile class, is simply breezing through the dungeon, despite intentionally completely reckless gameplay, and what are probably 'average' mage stats.

The problem, as I see it, is that resting is too easy. Once a corner of the dungeon is clear, one simply needs to retreat there for a 100% chance of undisturbed rest, and even that's not necessary. Often any empty room will make a suitable place to rest undisturbed. I believe this is thanks to the rewritten dungeon generation that seems to often connect distant places with long corridors (and no spawning).

Although this character is arguably more exciting on paper than my previous, having found things like altars, and circles frequently (and even an ego or two), It's not much fun to play. It goes something like this... rest, pelt enemies with spells, retreat and repeat if necessary, gather loot, repeat. If you eliminate the rest, then everything falls apart and the game becomes unplayable. Mages gotta have mana.

I guess my point is that torches (as a timer) don't provide an effective incentive to not to waste turns resting. Resting makes for boring play. Not resting results in inability to kill anything, and possible death. Escape is still manageable even with next to no mana.

I realize the game will get harder. Enemies will get both harder to kill and more deadly, but I don't that will help much. It will simply shift from survive no matter what you stupid decisions you make, to die no matter what you do unless you rest even more. I can't take this character seriously, don't care whether he lives or dies, don't even care to play it anymore except as a novelty to see how much deeper he can go while I just mash the keyboard.

To make things worse, up to this point he's relied almost entirely on his own mana. No substantial amount of consumables or items (or blessings) aiding his progress, else things would be even easier.