tl;dr
I'm new to Angband generally, played dungeon crawl stone soup for a long time (if you haven't, check it out, it's awesome ). I'm playing a pretty old version - Zangband tk 2.4.0r5. I'd like some help with my character and what I should be doing and also something about spells. I'd be very interested in some feedback from experienced player on these comments - thanks.
I'm at stat-gain depth at the moment with my vampire warrior-mage guy and doing ok but he seems to lack 'oomph'. I can't do anything to kill things fast. Warrior-mage seemed like a good idea at the time and suits a vampire well but arcane magic I've since discovered kind of sucks, it's all very convenient for a while but I suspect in late or even mid game it will become just a waste.
For example the detection line of spells were handy but now I have two rods of detection I never use them. As I go deeper I'm discovering anything you can do with Arcane you can do with items easier and for no mana. Sure they take up slots, which may become much more important later, but at the moment the only thing from arcane I bother using are the resistance spells, and then only very rarely for something like an ancient dragon where it's obvious what low element it breathes. (to go off topic for a moment, dragons seem disappointingly underpowered in Zangband - I have no doubt there are some lethal unique dragons out there but dragons are supposed to be very rare and epically strong in general. When my pretty tame level 30ish character yawns when he encounters an 'ancient dragon' something isn't right). The only spell I can see on the list that might be useful is the Clairvoyance spell, but I can probably get the same effect from some item.
The other realm I got to choose, and what I chose for my evil vampire lord of pain and terror was, surprise, death magic. This is much more useful but I have some gripes. First, nether bolt is a bit crappy because almost everything seems to resist nether but without it saying so in the monster description. The end result is that sometimes malediction does more damage ('pound for pound', malediction is a great spell). At level 30+ however I can't rely on that. Orb of entropy is kind of useful for clearing low-level crowds but since it's a drain-life spell a lot of things are immune and it doesn't have the power to be useful in fighting dangerous stuff. My main attack spell at the moment is vampiric drain. Pretty good, but since it replenishes life it does less damage for the same mana than a pure attack spell would, which means I usually use it to heal since I can do more damage with my weapon, plus a great many things are immune to it. So basically I'm a weakish warrior and as a mage I have no decent attack spell, plus the game keeps giving me quest uniques that just laugh at me. Should I just scum for a good artifact weapon or carry some rods or something? Here's the character dump -
[ZAngbandTk 2.4.0 Character Dump]
[Character Equipment]
a) The Small Sword 'Sting' (2d6) (+10,+10) (+2)
b) (nothing)
c) a Ring of Slaying (+9,+10)
d) a Marble Ring of Confusion Resistance {cursed}
e) a Brass Amulet of Brilliance (+3)
f) The Incandescent Light of Edison (+3 to infravision)
g) The Metal Scale Mail of the Unseen (-2) [13,+19] (+4) {cursed}
h) an Elven Cloak [4,+10] (+4 to stealth)
i) a Large Metal Shield of Resistance [8,+13]
j) a Jingasa of Intelligence [4,+10] (+1) {cursed}
k) (nothing)
l) a Pair of Soft Leather Boots of Stealth [2,+17] (+3 to stealth)
[Character Inventory]
a) 2 Arcane Spellbooks [Cantrips for Beginners]
b) 2 Arcane Spellbooks [Minor Arcana]
c) 2 Arcane Spellbooks [Major Arcana]
d) 2 Death Spellbooks [Black Prayers]
e) a Death Spellbook [Black Mass]
f) 9 Yellow Potions of Healing
g) 2 Metallic Green Potions of Restore Mana
h) 8 Scrolls titled "jahab argtue" of Teleportation
i) a Scroll titled "itder xuxu ion" of Teleport Level
j) a Scroll titled "viver bjorulk" of Enchant Weapon Skill
k) a Silver Rod of Recall
l) 2 Hexagonal Rods of Detection (1 charging)
m) a Wand of Teleport Other (11 charges)
n) a Staff of Perception (21 charges)
o) a Mistletoe Staff of Probing (8 charges)
p) a Zircon Ring of Dexterity
q) an Aquamarine Ring of Combat
r) 2 Pearl Rings of Nexus Resistance
s) a Mithril Ring of Sound Resistance
t) a Stone and Hide Armour [15] {cursed}
u) a Quarterstaff (1d9)
v) a Dwarven Shovel (1d3) (+0,+0) (+3)
[Home Inventory - Morivant]
a) a Brown Speckled Potion of Berserk Strength
b) a Green Potion of *Healing*
c) a Scroll titled "sefjo bekbar" of *Identify*
d) a Titanium Wand of Clone Monster (9 charges)
e) an Azurite Ring of Free Action
f) a Ruby Ring of Skill (+14) {uncursed}
g) an Adamantite Ring of Light and Darkness Resistance
h) a Gold Ring of Shard Resistance
i) an Amulet of Charisma (+4)
j) an Amber Amulet of Reflection
k) a Copper Amulet of Anti-Teleportation
l) The Phial of Galadriel (+1 to searching)
m) a Cord Armour of Elvenkind [6,+11] (+3 to stealth)
n) a Pair of Soft Leather Boots of Free Action [2,+10]
o) a Pair of Metal Shod Boots of Free Action [6,+6]
p) a Two-Handed Sword (Defender) (3d6) (+8,+7) [+7] (+1 to stealth)
q) a Two-Handed Sword of Westernesse (3d6) (+9,+8) (+1)
r) a Two-Handed Sword (Trump Weapon) (3d6) (+8,+12) (+1 to searching)
s) The Spear of Hagen (1d6) (+11,+13) (+3 to speed)
t) The Beaked Axe of Theoden (2d6) (+8,+10) (+3)
u) a Whip (Trump Weapon) (1d6) (+9,+10) (+1 to searching)
v) a Heavy Crossbow of Extra Shots (x5) (+19,+6)
w) 7 Magical Figurines of a Greater hell-beast
I've looked over this death magic article http://www.zangband.org/spoilers/death.txt many times and here are some comments about the spells - what do you think?
Horrify: attempts to terrify and stun one monster
Doesn't seem to work often enough to use / lot of things are immune
Enslave the Undead: attempts to control one undead creature
Why bother when you can just kill it? Have never found a situation where I thought casting it would be useful, so I'm not sure if it works at a decent rate, probably not. If something is powerful enough that you can't kill it easily and you might want to cast this on it then it will probably resist, and you waste a turn that could have been used to do something else.
Terror: attempts to scare all visible monsters, power 30+level
Probably only effective against weaker monsters, which you would kill instead using a ball spell. Unless you're in the middle of crowd of things meleeing you (which you never should be) there's no point to this. If you're against one big bad guy, horrify has an extra stun effect - not sure what the power is on that. In any case I wouldn't bother casting either.
The following are spells I can't cast, either because I'm not at the level or haven't got the book. Here's my impression from the descriptions. Please point out anything good about these spells I overlook.
Dispel Good: 1d(level*4) damage to all good creatures in sight
Doesn't seem to be many good monsters in the game
Restore Life: restores drained XP
I already have Hold Life, not 100% effective but fine for me at the moment, and this spell is really high level for some reason, seems useless.
Berserk/Battle-Frenzy
Ah, these are spells I looked forward to when I first made the character. Warrior-mage buffing himself magically is pretty, well, pretty much what a warrior-mage does. But neither of them are in the shop books . Berserk is only level 10, why is it not in 'Black Mass'? When I finally get my hands on Black Channels (at what depth do the first dungeon books usually drop btw?) then I'll only cast Battle-Frenzy, never Berserk, so that's a waste of a spell.
Invoke Spirits
Seems completely useless
Dark bolt
Damage is underwhelming and lots of things are immune - same problems as with nether bolt
Death Ray: damage level*200. If (monster level)+1d20 is
greater than 1d(player level)+1d10, the monster
resists. Unique monsters have only a 1 in 888 chance of
being affected. Undead and nonliving creatures always
resist.
Will probably never cast it due to extremely low chance of working on anything worth using it on.
Raise the Dead: 1 in 3, summons an undead (if level less than
48) or greater undead (otherwise) which will try
to kill you. 2 in 3, summons a friendly undead or
a friendly greater undead. If level greater than
24 and 1d3=1, you can get a group of undead.
Summoning spells are bad enough without having a big chance to summon hostile.
Evocation: 1d(level*4) damage to all monsters in sight, attempts
to scare all monsters (power level*4) and attempts to
banish all monsters (power level*4)
Sounds cool. About banishment btw, what does that mean? Destroy or teleport away or delete with no XP? Does it only work on summoned monsters? Does the game recognise which monsters have been summoned and which haven't?
Hellfire 50 135 95
Ommnicide 50 100 95
Wraithform 50 123 95
These sound great, but I'm not sure if I'll ever be able to cast them at a decent rate. The numbers here are level, mana, failure, for me. So given that I started with 18/40 INT what kind of failure rate will I have on these at max stats?
Regarding the genocide line of spells -
I've read that these are a main reason people choose death magic. Genocide deletes all monsters of a type on the whole level without xp, is that right? Can I die from the damage? Given that omnicide costs more mana than mass genocide, isn't mass genocide superior? You get one mana for every killed monster with omnicide but you'ld have to kill 15+ to make up for the initial difference, and it has a higher fail rate. The radius on mass genocide is huge already so that doesn't seem to make a difference.
Regarding summoning and trump magic -
Summoning seems like a total waste of time. You don't get XP for the kills and I had a look at the Trump spells - boy I wouldn't want to be a Trump high-mage. Not only do you get no XP, your summons suck. Trump magic seems terrible. The dungeon monsters on the other hand all seems to be master summoners - sometimes a unique will summon a monster much more dangerous than the unique, and it gets annoying when a unique summons summoners.
One last question, here is the skill bonus table from the website - what do these numbers mean? For example 'Melee 70+45'. Is there any difference between that and '60+55'? How much of an effect do these starting bonuses have on the difference in prowess between end-game characters? It's all a bit vague for me.
Many thanks.
I'm new to Angband generally, played dungeon crawl stone soup for a long time (if you haven't, check it out, it's awesome ). I'm playing a pretty old version - Zangband tk 2.4.0r5. I'd like some help with my character and what I should be doing and also something about spells. I'd be very interested in some feedback from experienced player on these comments - thanks.
I'm at stat-gain depth at the moment with my vampire warrior-mage guy and doing ok but he seems to lack 'oomph'. I can't do anything to kill things fast. Warrior-mage seemed like a good idea at the time and suits a vampire well but arcane magic I've since discovered kind of sucks, it's all very convenient for a while but I suspect in late or even mid game it will become just a waste.
For example the detection line of spells were handy but now I have two rods of detection I never use them. As I go deeper I'm discovering anything you can do with Arcane you can do with items easier and for no mana. Sure they take up slots, which may become much more important later, but at the moment the only thing from arcane I bother using are the resistance spells, and then only very rarely for something like an ancient dragon where it's obvious what low element it breathes. (to go off topic for a moment, dragons seem disappointingly underpowered in Zangband - I have no doubt there are some lethal unique dragons out there but dragons are supposed to be very rare and epically strong in general. When my pretty tame level 30ish character yawns when he encounters an 'ancient dragon' something isn't right). The only spell I can see on the list that might be useful is the Clairvoyance spell, but I can probably get the same effect from some item.
The other realm I got to choose, and what I chose for my evil vampire lord of pain and terror was, surprise, death magic. This is much more useful but I have some gripes. First, nether bolt is a bit crappy because almost everything seems to resist nether but without it saying so in the monster description. The end result is that sometimes malediction does more damage ('pound for pound', malediction is a great spell). At level 30+ however I can't rely on that. Orb of entropy is kind of useful for clearing low-level crowds but since it's a drain-life spell a lot of things are immune and it doesn't have the power to be useful in fighting dangerous stuff. My main attack spell at the moment is vampiric drain. Pretty good, but since it replenishes life it does less damage for the same mana than a pure attack spell would, which means I usually use it to heal since I can do more damage with my weapon, plus a great many things are immune to it. So basically I'm a weakish warrior and as a mage I have no decent attack spell, plus the game keeps giving me quest uniques that just laugh at me. Should I just scum for a good artifact weapon or carry some rods or something? Here's the character dump -
[ZAngbandTk 2.4.0 Character Dump]
Code:
Name Kremlath III Age 112 Self RB CB EB Best Sex Male Height 58 STR: 18/77 +3 +2 +2 18/147 Race Vampire Weight 140 INT: 18/75 +3 +2 +8 18/205 Class Warrior-Mage Status 3 Wis: 18 -1 +0 +3 18/20 18/10 Title Mage-Hero HP 304/304 DEX: 18/91 -1 +1 +2 18/111 Realm 1 Arcane SP 264/264 Con: 15 +1 +0 +2 18 15 Realm 2 Death Maximize Y CHR: 18/95 +2 +1 +0 18/125 Patron Khorne Preserve Y Level 33 Fighting Saving Throw Superb Cur Exp 502529 + to Skill 26 Stealth Chaos Rank Max Exp 502529 Deadliness 214% Fighting Excellent Adv Exp 687500 Blows/Round 3 Shooting Good Disarming Superb Gold 161012 Shooting Magic Device Chaos Rank + to Skill 16 Perception Excellent Armor [31,+76] Deadliness 187% Searching Very Good Burden 151.1 lbs Shots/Round 1.0 Infravision 80 ft In life you were a powerful noble. You have a hairless head, blank white eyes, and a deathly pale complexion.
Code:
[Miscellaneous information] Autoscum: OFF Small Levels: ON Arena Levels: ENABLED Hard Quests: OFF Num. Random Quests: 20 Nightmare Mode: OFF Recall Depth: Level 38 (1900') You have defeated 19599 enemies.
[Character Equipment]
a) The Small Sword 'Sting' (2d6) (+10,+10) (+2)
b) (nothing)
c) a Ring of Slaying (+9,+10)
d) a Marble Ring of Confusion Resistance {cursed}
e) a Brass Amulet of Brilliance (+3)
f) The Incandescent Light of Edison (+3 to infravision)
g) The Metal Scale Mail of the Unseen (-2) [13,+19] (+4) {cursed}
h) an Elven Cloak [4,+10] (+4 to stealth)
i) a Large Metal Shield of Resistance [8,+13]
j) a Jingasa of Intelligence [4,+10] (+1) {cursed}
k) (nothing)
l) a Pair of Soft Leather Boots of Stealth [2,+17] (+3 to stealth)
[Character Inventory]
a) 2 Arcane Spellbooks [Cantrips for Beginners]
b) 2 Arcane Spellbooks [Minor Arcana]
c) 2 Arcane Spellbooks [Major Arcana]
d) 2 Death Spellbooks [Black Prayers]
e) a Death Spellbook [Black Mass]
f) 9 Yellow Potions of Healing
g) 2 Metallic Green Potions of Restore Mana
h) 8 Scrolls titled "jahab argtue" of Teleportation
i) a Scroll titled "itder xuxu ion" of Teleport Level
j) a Scroll titled "viver bjorulk" of Enchant Weapon Skill
k) a Silver Rod of Recall
l) 2 Hexagonal Rods of Detection (1 charging)
m) a Wand of Teleport Other (11 charges)
n) a Staff of Perception (21 charges)
o) a Mistletoe Staff of Probing (8 charges)
p) a Zircon Ring of Dexterity
q) an Aquamarine Ring of Combat
r) 2 Pearl Rings of Nexus Resistance
s) a Mithril Ring of Sound Resistance
t) a Stone and Hide Armour [15] {cursed}
u) a Quarterstaff (1d9)
v) a Dwarven Shovel (1d3) (+0,+0) (+3)
[Home Inventory - Morivant]
a) a Brown Speckled Potion of Berserk Strength
b) a Green Potion of *Healing*
c) a Scroll titled "sefjo bekbar" of *Identify*
d) a Titanium Wand of Clone Monster (9 charges)
e) an Azurite Ring of Free Action
f) a Ruby Ring of Skill (+14) {uncursed}
g) an Adamantite Ring of Light and Darkness Resistance
h) a Gold Ring of Shard Resistance
i) an Amulet of Charisma (+4)
j) an Amber Amulet of Reflection
k) a Copper Amulet of Anti-Teleportation
l) The Phial of Galadriel (+1 to searching)
m) a Cord Armour of Elvenkind [6,+11] (+3 to stealth)
n) a Pair of Soft Leather Boots of Free Action [2,+10]
o) a Pair of Metal Shod Boots of Free Action [6,+6]
p) a Two-Handed Sword (Defender) (3d6) (+8,+7) [+7] (+1 to stealth)
q) a Two-Handed Sword of Westernesse (3d6) (+9,+8) (+1)
r) a Two-Handed Sword (Trump Weapon) (3d6) (+8,+12) (+1 to searching)
s) The Spear of Hagen (1d6) (+11,+13) (+3 to speed)
t) The Beaked Axe of Theoden (2d6) (+8,+10) (+3)
u) a Whip (Trump Weapon) (1d6) (+9,+10) (+1 to searching)
v) a Heavy Crossbow of Extra Shots (x5) (+19,+6)
w) 7 Magical Figurines of a Greater hell-beast
I've looked over this death magic article http://www.zangband.org/spoilers/death.txt many times and here are some comments about the spells - what do you think?
Horrify: attempts to terrify and stun one monster
Doesn't seem to work often enough to use / lot of things are immune
Enslave the Undead: attempts to control one undead creature
Why bother when you can just kill it? Have never found a situation where I thought casting it would be useful, so I'm not sure if it works at a decent rate, probably not. If something is powerful enough that you can't kill it easily and you might want to cast this on it then it will probably resist, and you waste a turn that could have been used to do something else.
Terror: attempts to scare all visible monsters, power 30+level
Probably only effective against weaker monsters, which you would kill instead using a ball spell. Unless you're in the middle of crowd of things meleeing you (which you never should be) there's no point to this. If you're against one big bad guy, horrify has an extra stun effect - not sure what the power is on that. In any case I wouldn't bother casting either.
The following are spells I can't cast, either because I'm not at the level or haven't got the book. Here's my impression from the descriptions. Please point out anything good about these spells I overlook.
Dispel Good: 1d(level*4) damage to all good creatures in sight
Doesn't seem to be many good monsters in the game
Restore Life: restores drained XP
I already have Hold Life, not 100% effective but fine for me at the moment, and this spell is really high level for some reason, seems useless.
Berserk/Battle-Frenzy
Ah, these are spells I looked forward to when I first made the character. Warrior-mage buffing himself magically is pretty, well, pretty much what a warrior-mage does. But neither of them are in the shop books . Berserk is only level 10, why is it not in 'Black Mass'? When I finally get my hands on Black Channels (at what depth do the first dungeon books usually drop btw?) then I'll only cast Battle-Frenzy, never Berserk, so that's a waste of a spell.
Invoke Spirits
Seems completely useless
Dark bolt
Damage is underwhelming and lots of things are immune - same problems as with nether bolt
Death Ray: damage level*200. If (monster level)+1d20 is
greater than 1d(player level)+1d10, the monster
resists. Unique monsters have only a 1 in 888 chance of
being affected. Undead and nonliving creatures always
resist.
Will probably never cast it due to extremely low chance of working on anything worth using it on.
Raise the Dead: 1 in 3, summons an undead (if level less than
48) or greater undead (otherwise) which will try
to kill you. 2 in 3, summons a friendly undead or
a friendly greater undead. If level greater than
24 and 1d3=1, you can get a group of undead.
Summoning spells are bad enough without having a big chance to summon hostile.
Evocation: 1d(level*4) damage to all monsters in sight, attempts
to scare all monsters (power level*4) and attempts to
banish all monsters (power level*4)
Sounds cool. About banishment btw, what does that mean? Destroy or teleport away or delete with no XP? Does it only work on summoned monsters? Does the game recognise which monsters have been summoned and which haven't?
Hellfire 50 135 95
Ommnicide 50 100 95
Wraithform 50 123 95
These sound great, but I'm not sure if I'll ever be able to cast them at a decent rate. The numbers here are level, mana, failure, for me. So given that I started with 18/40 INT what kind of failure rate will I have on these at max stats?
Regarding the genocide line of spells -
I've read that these are a main reason people choose death magic. Genocide deletes all monsters of a type on the whole level without xp, is that right? Can I die from the damage? Given that omnicide costs more mana than mass genocide, isn't mass genocide superior? You get one mana for every killed monster with omnicide but you'ld have to kill 15+ to make up for the initial difference, and it has a higher fail rate. The radius on mass genocide is huge already so that doesn't seem to make a difference.
Regarding summoning and trump magic -
Summoning seems like a total waste of time. You don't get XP for the kills and I had a look at the Trump spells - boy I wouldn't want to be a Trump high-mage. Not only do you get no XP, your summons suck. Trump magic seems terrible. The dungeon monsters on the other hand all seems to be master summoners - sometimes a unique will summon a monster much more dangerous than the unique, and it gets annoying when a unique summons summoners.
One last question, here is the skill bonus table from the website - what do these numbers mean? For example 'Melee 70+45'. Is there any difference between that and '60+55'? How much of an effect do these starting bonuses have on the difference in prowess between end-game characters? It's all a bit vague for me.
Code:
Dsrm Dvce Save Stlh Srch Melee Bows Warrior 25+12 18+7 18+10 1 14/2 70+45 55+45 Mage 30+7 36+13 30+9 2 15/20 34+15 20+15 Priest 25+7 30+10 32+12 2 16/8 48+20 35+20 Rogue 45+15 32+10 28+10 5 32/24 60+40 66+30 Ranger 30+8 32+10 28+10 3 24/16 56+30 72+45 Paladin 20+7 24+10 26+11 1 12/2 68+35 40+30 Warrior-Mage 30+7 30+10 28+9 2 18/16 50+20 25+20 Chaos Warrior 20+7 25+11 25+10 1 14/12 65+34 40+29 Monk 45+15 32+11 28+10 5 32/24 64+40 60+30 Mindcrafter 30+10 30+10 30+10 3 22/16 50+20 40+30 High Mage 30+7 36+13 30+9 2 15/20 34+15 20+15
Many thanks.
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