Vanilla is better than it used to be

[will_asher]

I've been distracted from working on my own variant by playing vanilla. The game is definitely better than it used to be. Here's just a few new things I like about current Angband that vanilla didn't have when I stopped playing several years ago:
- throwing weapons (I had them in my old variant but they weren't in V when I played before)
- more special rooms
- rune-based ID
- cutting out some stupid useless objects (like !slow poison)
- when you run, you stop two spaces away from a monster instead of right next to it.
- pits are smaller
- and the new classes seem cool too

So I thought I'd post a thank you to Nick and whoever else has been maintaining Angband in the past several years.

[Pete Mack]

I agree getting rid of junk consumables was a good choice. What's problematic is the level limit on certain objects and ego items. The result is that very rare uber ego items like +10 BoSpeed and MoD (HA) now show up in nearly every game.

[Egavactip]

Sure, Vanilla is better than it used to be if you stretch the time range out enough. There have been numerous improvements over the years. However, I am not a fan of 4.2.x. There are some things I like in it, some things I can tolerate, and other things that I don't like or that even drive me crazy. There's no point in my listing anything as I have pointed out issues in the past and always been ignored.

I will say that I think at least two of the new classes--blackguards and druids--are largely duds as far as I am concerned. I haven't tried necromancer yet.

[Selkie]

I will say that I think at least two of the new classes--blackguards and druids--are largely duds as far as I am concerned. I haven't tried necromancer yet.

I'm a huge fan of blackguards, and am just starting to appreciate druids. Once I've won the game with a druid I'm going to write a full review of the class and spells.

[DavidMedley]

.I will say that I think at least two of the new classes--blackguards and druids--are largely duds as far as I am concerned.

Did you try 4.2.1 or later Blackguard?

[Selkie]

Did you try 4.2.1 or later Blackguard?

Are you suggesting 4.2.1 BG is a dud? I've played A LOT of Angband in 2021 (thanks to the pandemic) and so far BG is my favourite class

[DavidMedley]

No, I'm very much hoping that 4.2.1 Blackguard is NOT a dud! I've gotten enough positive feedback that I'm confident it's a big improvement, while understandably not everyone's cup of tea.

[janellbliss]

Vanilla Angband is the only band I've ever put serious time into. I like it because I actually like a bit of grind sometimes over "creative play". I like the ability to do some semi-safe grinding until I'm ready to do a deeper dive.

[Pete Mack]

@Selkie--
4.2 Paladin is definitely an improvement. 4.2 Rogue... not so much.

[archolewa]

@Selkie--
4.2 Paladin is definitely an improvement. 4.2 Rogue... not so much.

I can't imagine how ridiculously powerful Rogues must have been before 4.2 then. I recently pulled off my second Rogue win, and aside from the fact that the RNG decided Wands of Annihiliation would be rarer than Rings of Power (seriously, I found all three elven Rings of Power, and only two Wands of Annihilation), that game went smooth as glass. They have enough hit points and good enough offense, both melee and ranged, that the early game isn't very dangerous. Their incredible detection spells and high stealth means that the midgame is theirs for the taking, and renewable TO, high device skills, high hitpoints, and high combat skills means that the endgame isn't a problem either. Granted, I wouldn't call them unique killers, but they don't really need to be.

They also feel like a very dynamic class to me, using every available option for dealing with problems: swords, bows, devices, and spells. Most every other class I've played basically ignores one of those.

It was especially fun making such heavy use of devices. Most classes can't because they don't have reliable recharging. While mages have recharging, their arms are too noodly, and their inventory too full of books to have much capacity for them.

Certainly I had a lot more fun with my Rogues than my Mages...ugh. Even when I got Ultimate Power, I found my Mage a drag and being one bad breath away from death even in the endgame just made it worse.

[DavidMedley]

their arms are too noodly

Haha what does this mean?

[archolewa]

Haha what does this mean?

Their strength penalty, plus how heavy (and numerous) their books are means for much of the game you really don't have any spare weight. Especially if you don't play with WoR, because that means you need to carry lots of duplicates for *three* books so that you don't lose access to such important spells as TO or Resistance.

Sure wands aren't heavy, but when you're consistently running 0.1 pounds away from a speed penalty, even an extra wand is one too many. Rogues meanwhile have only one town book, and a higher strength. So not only do they have more inventory slots available for wands, but they also have more carrying capacity for carrying multiple copies.