ESP vs. definition of "see"

[Moving Pictures]

There are a couple of toys out there that deal damage to "all (evil) creatures you can see," thinking the dispel evil line, staff of power, and an amulet that also pushes out damage. (Which, now I think of it, I may have accidentally purged. oops.)

Does "see" equal "unobstructed path with ESP" or actual "If there were no ESP, what was actually lit either by player lamp/phial/whatever and room?"

[Derakon]

It's "if the level were completely lit and you did not have any ESP, all (evil) creatures you can see".

[Moving Pictures]

Addendum: room "illuminated" by a Clairvoyance spell also serves to make all the critters therein "visible."

As a room of dragons discovered after eating a six-pack of "dispel evil" spells. I had to.

[Grotug]

Just to clarify, if you are sharing space with evil critters in a square room and you are blind and you use a staff of dispel evil, the evil critters will get damaged, even though you can't see them. Basically, the object you are using on the monsters has to have Line of Sight to the monsters per Derakon's phrasing.

[Sky]

for some reason Detect Invisible shows you invisible creatures behind walls, i'm thinking maybe that's not the way it should work.

[Pete Mack]

The point is to avoid invisible monsters before running into them. This really matters for a character at DL36 or deeper without SI.

for some reason Detect Invisible shows you invisible creatures behind walls, i'm thinking maybe that's not the way it should work.

[luneya]

The point is to avoid invisible monsters before running into them. This really matters for a character at DL36 or deeper without SI.

Plus a lot of the nasty invisibles are wall-walking ghosts that move somewhat erratically, so your LOS is likely to be blocked by a wall when you encounter them. Moreover, the mage detect invisible spell (or its staff/scroll equivalent) is intended to be an ESP-like magical detection. The priest see invisible spell (or potion of true sight) actually gives you the ability to see invisible things using normal LOS, just like the see invisible equipment/racial bonus.