Speed v Damage

[Dikaiopolis]

Playing 3.5.1

High Elf Warrior, CL37, DL47

Which would be the most advisable combination:

Speed 35, average damage 310 (RoS +7, RoS +15);
Speed 28, average damage 406 (RoS +15, RoD +14);
Speed 13, average damage 482 (RoD +14, RoD +11)?

Would it be worthwhile to switch one to =CON+3 for 75 more HP?

I've been playing off and on since starting to play again a year ago. I still don't have a feel for Speed in this game, particularly when I should stop adding Speed at the expense of other things.

Thanks for any help.

[Gwarl]

my vote goes to option 2.

+15! holy heck that's a nice =speed

(also try upgrading to 4.1.0 for your next game)

[Estie]

Number 2 of your list is best. To make statements about the con rings I need to know your current hit points. If its 700 or higher, dont use con ring.

Simplified speed rules:

-speed +10: doubles your base speed, this is better than pretty much anything else you can get in the game.

-speed +20: this is sufficient for lategame; more is not needed except in special cases.

-speed +30: the maximum effective speed; speed beyond this point is less useful than pretty much any alternative (diminished returns).

The optimal way in the lategame is normally to have +20 speed and use a temporary buff to get to +30 for fast bosses.

I still wish the actual speed was displayed on the character sheet; it would make threads like these unneccessary.

[Dikaiopolis]

Thanks for the help. Number 2 was my thinking, and I left the CON at home.

From what I've read here, 4.1.0 contains some significant changes, and I don't want to lose the feel of "classic" Angband right now. I will install it at some point. I've been playing since Moria back in 1980 or so. I'm not always a big fan of change, lol. And anything other than ASCII graphics is sacrilege.

[Monkey Face]

You want +30 speed before taking on Morgoth but +28 should be enough for just about anyone else.

[Sky]

i have found two rings on speed +20 in two games, one after the other.

[PowerWyrm]

You want +30 speed before taking on Morgoth but +28 should be enough for just about anyone else.

Or +20 and 100% saving throw (to be safe vs Brain Smash). At this point, you should have enough potions of speed (or the spell) to reach +30.

[Dikaiopolis]

Rather than start a new thread, I'll ask this here. At what point should I start carrying around the !Healing, !*Healing*, !Speed, ?Banishment, etc that I have been stockpiling at home? Should I be saving them for Sauron and Morgoth? Or should I have them on hand for other high uniques? I've started carrying around staves of Speed (or potions if my home is full). I will only occasionally use my !CCW, so should I be leaving them behind?

HE warrior, cl40, dl60. Golden Crown of Gondor for confusion, stun, etc. Resists aren't a problem, and I have a base speed of +20.

[Derakon]

You should be carrying some !Healing on-hand pretty much as soon as your max HP is large enough for it to potentially be relevant. *Healing* generally should be saved for the final fights, as should !Speed as soon as you have a Staff of Speed. ?Banish isn't that helpful in the final fights; summons will tend to have a variety of letters and/or be unique. ?MassBanish is definitely worth saving though, as is ?Destruction. I do however try to carry one ?Destruction with me for emergencies during general exploration. It's the same principle as with !Healing -- if you don't survive until Sauron/Morgoth, then there was no point in stockpiling those consumables.

The thing to be aware of with Sauron/Morgoth is that they drain charges with their melee attacks, which heals them in the process. Consequently, carrying staves or wands when meleeing them is not recommended. Staves of Speed/Destruction can be very useful in getting to the final fights, but they shouldn't be used during said fights. Though you can use them at the start and then drop them on the ground, to save yourself a potion/scroll before the fight starts.

[Pete Mack]

You should always carry around a couple healing potions "just in case." You can even use them deliberately against high value uniques, just like you would with restore Mana potions.
Banishment and Destruction scrolls, not so much. They are very rare and very useful against Morgoth. Use Banishment staffs instead. Carry Teleport Level as the guaranteed escape of choice, with *Destruction* scrolls only if you run out.
I suppose if you play slowly, you can plan to use a few banishment scrolls before the final bosses, but extras of these is very much a luxury you shouldn't plan for.

[Dikaiopolis]

You should be carrying some !Healing on-hand pretty much as soon as your max HP is large enough for it to potentially be relevant. *Healing* generally should be saved for the final fights, as should !Speed as soon as you have a Staff of Speed. ?Banish isn't that helpful in the final fights; summons will tend to have a variety of letters and/or be unique. ?MassBanish is definitely worth saving though, as is ?Destruction. I do however try to carry one ?Destruction with me for emergencies during general exploration. It's the same principle as with !Healing -- if you don't survive until Sauron/Morgoth, then there was no point in stockpiling those consumables.

The thing to be aware of with Sauron/Morgoth is that they drain charges with their melee attacks, which heals them in the process. Consequently, carrying staves or wands when meleeing them is not recommended. Staves of Speed/Destruction can be very useful in getting to the final fights, but they shouldn't be used during said fights. Though you can use them at the start and then drop them on the ground, to save yourself a potion/scroll before the fight starts.

Thanks, Derakon. It's been so long since I have encountered S and M, that I did not know about the wand/staff business.

[Pete Mack]

Derakon's point about staffs and wands only holds for melee. If you're a ranger or plan to use magic and/or wands of Annihilation, take all the devices you want to the final battles. But yes, in general, save the scrolls (and potions of speed) for the end, and use staffs and wands to get yourself there.
Potions of Healing and Restore Mana are more common and can be used with discretion throughout the game. And I repeat:
Scrolls if Teleport Level are worthless against the bosses and should be your guaranteed escape of choice for the majority of the game.

I disagree with Derakon's about scrolls of Banishment: Morgoth sometimes summons Demons or Dragons, against whih these scrolls work well. And even undead summons will often have only one dangerous monster genus which can be banished explicitly, leaving some harmless monsters usefully filling up space.

[Dikaiopolis]

Derakon's point about staffs and wands only holds for melee. If you're a ranger or plan to use magic and/or wands of Annihilation, take all the devices you want to the final battles. But yes, in general, save the scrolls (and potions of speed) for the end, and use staffs and wands to get yourself there.
Potions of Healing and Restore Mana are more common and can be used with discretion throughout the game. And I repeat:
Scrolls if Teleport Level are worthless against the bosses and should be your guaranteed escape of choice for the majority of the game.

I disagree with Derakon's about scrolls of Banishment: Morgoth sometimes summons Demons or Dragons, against whih these scrolls work well. And even undead summons will often have only one dangerous monster genus which can be banished explicitly, leaving some harmless monsters usefully filling up space.

Thanks, Pete Mack! I'll keep that in mind.