RoS +19?

[donalde]

Hi

I am playing angband-v3.5-dev-443-gc244371, a game changer on The I in the Storm GV:

d) a Ring of Speed <+19>
Found lying on the floor in a vault at 4250 feet (level 85).

... I though that RoS were +15 max?

[PowerWyrm]

There's no limit in the speed bonus you can get from rings. A player in MAngband once found a +23 ring.

[Derakon]

Rings of Speed get a depth-dependent bonus, but then they get "supercharged": a coin is flipped, and if it comes up heads, 1 is added to the bonus and the coin is flipped again. This repeats until the coin comes up tails. As a result, theoretically you could get a Ring of Speed +100; it's just incredibly unlikely (something like 1 in 2^92).

[donalde]

derakon, thanks for the info. I was bit confused since I don't recall seeing more than +16. that +19 changes game quite a bit, I could wear ring of damage +12, big kick on hT Warrior wearing randart +2 attack ball & chain.

Or would extra +12 in speed make difference on damage output, speed +30 vs speed +42? Too advanced maths for me, maybe Timo knows.

[MattB]

Or would extra +12 in speed make difference on damage output, speed +30 vs speed +42? Too advanced maths for me, maybe Timo knows.

By my maths, an increase from spd+30 to spd+42 equates to an increase in activity of 10.526%, so not a huge amount, but significant. Obviously, that's not just 10% more damage inflicted, but ~10% less damage received (due to sooner death of assailant).

[Timo Pietilä]

By my maths, an increase from spd+30 to spd+42 equates to an increase in activity of 10.526%, so not a huge amount, but significant. Obviously, that's not just 10% more damage inflicted, but ~10% less damage received (due to sooner death of assailant).

It's 42/38 energy difference. Usually not worth it because it requires sacrificing something way more important, but with RoS+19 that might not be the case.

[MattB]

It's 42/38 energy difference. Usually not worth it because it requires sacrificing something way more important, but with RoS+19 that might not be the case.

Yep, 42/38 certainly is 1.10526!
Like you say, given that you'll be wearing a RoS, it might as well be a really good one.

[Derakon]

My usual take on this is that once you can hit +35 speed with temporary speed, you needn't focus on adding speed any more and might as well diversify. +35 is more or less completely arbitrary and may not actually be optimal; it's just that getting more usually involves, as Timo says, compromising your character in other areas.

[quarague]

I think 35 as top useful speed is a not arbitrary at all, very fast monsters have a base speed of +30, plus some variance, 35 should be the value that essentially guarantees that no monster ever gets a double move on you

[Timo Pietilä]

I think 35 as top useful speed is a not arbitrary at all, very fast monsters have a base speed of +30, plus some variance, 35 should be the value that essentially guarantees that no monster ever gets a double move on you

Very few monsters are extremely fast (+30+). Some vortices, some immobile things and some uniques, that's all. Monsters can be hasted though. Shrieking things are dangerous because of that (I hate crebain).

[Philip]

There are remarkably few monsters with speed variance(i.e.nonunique) with base speed of 30. Variance is also +-2. Honestly, Timo's example is the only reason you should be afraid of low speed, but chugging a potion can still prevent doublemoves.

[quarague]

Are they faster than +30? I thought the descriptions are slow=-10, normal=0, quick = +10, very quick=+20 and extremely quick=+30 and on top of that there is a small random factor. Or do some monster have base speed of more than +30?

[Timo Pietilä]

Are they faster than +30?

No, just that variance might get you +33 (IIRC, if base speed is +30 variance is also +-3). Hasted can be +40 though.

[Derakon]

No, just that variance might get you +33 (IIRC, if base speed is +30 variance is also +-3). Hasted can be +40 though.

Man, imagine if Morgoth had a Summon Crebain spell...