Class bonuses

[Derakon]

I'd still like to try changing the max level to 30 and having all remaining gains come from equipment and stats. Under such a scheme it might be feasible to have lower max level caps for some races, since each individual level would be more significant.

[buzzkill]

Someone a while back posted the idea of eliminating class bonuses entirely and leaving only racial bonuses. The reasoning behind the suggestion was that class bonuses are needed when you employ a random roller. With an auto-roller or the current default point allocation system, there's no need to "pre-select" by giving class bonuses.

Some people, well at least one person, still uses the standard roller.

[fizzix]

Some people, well at least one person, still uses the standard roller.

And I hope we never remove it.

[Tibarius]

stats

Originally posted by Zyphyr
The only effect that the XP penalties have is to alter final turncounts by forcing extra grinding. Nothing more.

Exactly - and thus is no real drawback in my eyes.

About stats: In my eyes the characters basic stats should only be influenced by race and class once and then should remain constant during the whole game, only be further modified by equipment. Maximum is 18/100 for all stats and all race / class combos (but only with equipment).

Stat potions or stat swap potions would complete be dropped.

More transparency, easier to understand mechanics ...

Number of blows only depends on str:
str <= 16 1 blow
at str 18 2 blows
at str 18/20 3 blows
at str 18/40 4 blows
at str 18/70 5 blows
at str 18/100 6 blows

And to keep mechanics in line ... number of shots only depends on dex:
dex <= 18/50 1 shot
at dex 18/50 2 shots
at dex 18/100 3 shots

This way the different classes need different much eq to hit those numbers.

[Napsterbater]

Am I the only one who actually likes the stat gain minigame?

[Tiburon Silverflame]

Tibarius, have you ever tried playing a mage? If not, try it, and see just how much of a PITA it is because of your 8 Str.

Number of blows only depends on str:
str <= 16 1 blow
at str 18 2 blows
at str 18/20 3 blows
at str 18/40 4 blows
at str 18/70 5 blows
at str 18/100 6 blows

Regardless of weapon weight...so everyone goes for the super-heavy weapon?

Simple and transparent sometimes means oversimplified and shallow.

[bio_hazard]

You could have weapon weight be more transparent. Break everything in to categories (as a simple example, light/medium/heavy), with (+1,0,-1) or (0,-1,-2) blows.

and if your 7 STR mage can't attack with the heavy weapon, GOOD.

[Derakon]

I don't think anyone suggested that 7-STR mages be able to use heavy weapons; they're just talking about the concept of simplifying how blows are calculated.

I do know that as soon as you remove DEX from the blows calculations, it becomes a dump stat. STR is still important for carrying inventory and wearing equipment, but DEX otherwise has a fairly negligible effect on your AC and chance to hit. If you want to simplify blows calculations, IMO the way to do it would be to have STR solely dictate "can you wield this weapon at all effectively" and DEX dictate the number of blows you get.

[Starhawk]

Am I the only one who actually likes the stat gain minigame?

No, sir-or-madam, you are not.

[Tibarius]

mages and combat concept

Originally posted by Tiburon Silverflame
Tibarius, have you ever tried playing a mage?

Yes i did play some dozens gnome/mages till i got a winner. And i agree the low STR is a real problem for the mage for a long time.

Originally posted by Derakon
they're just talking about the concept of simplifying how blows are calculated.

Yup, if the game mechanics are so complicated that only the program can calculate the results, it's basically impossible for the player to plan anything on their own, since they cannot estimate the consequences.

[Philip]

These are good and probably better suggestions. However, a dwarven priest under my system (remember, no class bonuses) is less awesome than in the current system.

I agree, but remember that now we have to compare to the other races as priest and no-one even comes close.