Overpowered Morgoth strategy

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  • Derakon
    Prophet
    • Dec 2009
    • 9022

    Overpowered Morgoth strategy

    I've noticed that Morgoth hasn't really been a worrying threat for me for quite some time now. Partially of course this comes down to being willing to spend all of my hoarded consumables against him, but I also have a very consistent strategy that he appears to be largely incapable of handling:

    1) Use Destruction to set up the battlefield.
    2) If he deals significant damage to me, use Phase Door and heal. I've yet to phase away and end up still in LOS of Morgoth or any remotely significant portion of his summons, given how densely Destructed areas are packed with debris.
    3) If he summons something I don't want to deal with, use Phase Door. He'll outstrip his summons (since he travels straight and faster than anything else in the game), which means even with Teleport Other as a bolt spell I can get rid of him. Then Destruct again to remove the other summons.

    That's it. My rogue, dealing upwards of 500 damage/round against evil, needed only 4 Destructions to win the fight; he had 7. I could have stretched that further if I had wanted to, by phasing away and then fleeing to a more remote part of the destructed area; by the time the old summons had caught up, I would probably have wanted to re-destruct anyway.

    It's not that the battle isn't climactic. This just seems to be an effective and consistent strategy that any character ought to be able to pull off if they keep all the Destruction scrolls they collect (or if, as anything other than a rogue or warrior, they're simply able to cast Word of Destruction).

    In your minds, is this strategy abusive or simply effective? Should it be nerfed? If so, how? Note that it works equally well against other enemies than Morgoth; you just have to chase them down after teleporting them away since they won't be able to reach you from anywhere on the level.
  • d_m
    Angband Devteam member
    • Aug 2008
    • 1517

    #2
    Originally posted by Derakon
    In your minds, is this strategy abusive or simply effective? Should it be nerfed? If so, how? Note that it works equally well against other enemies than Morgoth; you just have to chase them down after teleporting them away since they won't be able to reach you from anywhere on the level.
    I had been thinking about making the descruction effect much sparser than it is now. This would make it harder to use destructed battlefields for crowd control.

    I'm not immediately planning to do this, but I don't see anything intrinsically wrong with it from a flavor/consistency POV.
    linux->xterm->screen->pmacs

    Comment

    • Djabanete
      Knight
      • Apr 2007
      • 576

      #3
      Hengband makes life difficult by granting resistance to teleportation to certain deep monsters like Morgoth and the Serpent.

      Comment

      • Derakon
        Prophet
        • Dec 2009
        • 9022

        #4
        Originally posted by Djabanete
        Hengband makes life difficult by granting resistance to teleportation to certain deep monsters like Morgoth and the Serpent.
        In which case, an only marginally riskier strategy would be to teleport yourself away and use destruction to prepare a new battlefield.

        Comment

        • Tregonsee
          Adept
          • Jan 2011
          • 129

          #5
          Is there much difference between Earthquake and Destruction, aside from size of area?

          Comment

          • will_asher
            DaJAngband Maintainer
            • Apr 2007
            • 1124

            #6
            Destruction automatically removes all monsters and items other than artifacts.

            Earthquake only has a chance to damage monsters. I don't remember what it does with items in V, but in DAJ, items can be destroyed or buried in an earthquake. I think earthquake also has less chance to affect each tile in its area.
            Will_Asher
            aka LibraryAdventurer

            My old variant DaJAngband:
            http://sites.google.com/site/dajangbandwebsite/home (defunct and so old it's forked from Angband 3.1.0 -I think- but it's probably playable...)

            Comment

            • Derakon
              Prophet
              • Dec 2009
              • 9022

              #7
              Earthquake has a smaller radius, doesn't remove monsters, or items unless it decides to make a wall on the tile, and instead of turning every non-permanent-wall tile in the area into either open space or random wall, it has a chance to modify each tile -- most tiles are not affected.

              Earthquake can demonstrably remove items in V, since I accidentally buried Morgy's crown while playing with Grond.

              Comment

              • Timo Pietilä
                Prophet
                • Apr 2007
                • 4096

                #8
                Originally posted by Derakon
                Earthquake can demonstrably remove items in V, since I accidentally buried Morgy's crown while playing with Grond.
                Which version? Older versions never ever touched artifacts. Those were considered first, everything else was secondary.

                Comment

                • Zikke
                  Veteran
                  • Jun 2008
                  • 1069

                  #9
                  Originally posted by Derakon
                  In your minds, is this strategy abusive or simply effective? Should it be nerfed? If so, how?
                  In my opinion, it seems like you just are good at an effective strategy. Plenty of other people have a lot of problems with Morgoth even with that strategy.
                  A(3.1.0b) CWS "Fyren_V" NEW L:50 DL:127 A++ R+++ Sp+ w:The Great Axe of Eonwe
                  A/FA W H- D c-- !f PV+++ s? d P++ M+
                  C- S+ I- !So B ac++ GHB? SQ? !RQ V F:

                  Comment

                  • Derakon
                    Prophet
                    • Dec 2009
                    • 9022

                    #10
                    Originally posted by Timo Pietilä
                    Which version? Older versions never ever touched artifacts. Those were considered first, everything else was secondary.
                    Nightlies; my rogue winner was just earlier this week and he wasn't able to get the crown because he used Grond to mop up some summons.

                    Comment

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