Ridiculous death due, in my opinion, to flawed design.

[ThunderToads]

Ironically, this thread has gotten me back into playing the game after a two month absence.

That's awesome, not least 'cause it means means the troll failed miserably.

[Hariolor]

Funny thing I've noticed:

I have been playing more after a period away from the game to focus on IRL responsibilities, as such I am dying a lot more than I had been due to inattention and impatience. After my last game where I found Balance DSM at CL5 and then died to hunger because I let my light source run out, I contemplated turning on "cheat death" because those dumb mistakes are so frustrating and should be so easily avoided.

But I can't bring myself to do it. Strategy games don't punish save-scumming because the fun is in trying different strategies and tactics. Sims don't punish save scumming because the fun is in building. In fact, in most genres of games, the win condition is orthagonal to whether save-scumming is abusive, because the game is built around mastering some combination of reflexes and/or strategic thinking.

Roguelikes are sort of unique in that they do not require any reflexes whatsoever, and are mostly very very simple in terms of complexity. The strategy that has to be learned to win is one of patience, discipline, and persistence. Turning on "cheat death", or even save scumming, completely neuters the game because it allows the player to be reckless, which really eliminates the only strategic elements that must be mastered.

Obviously, YMMV, but a game that requires only being patient enough to be repeatedly rewarded by an RNG while avoiding the crap it throws at you almost necessarily becomes less and less interesting as risk is reduced.

[ehuangsan]

This reminds my of one monster I made on purpose to indicate that instadeath was definitely a possibility in Animeband. Perhaps a variation of this unique should be put into V? Death has -10 to speed, so you really have no excuse for getting killed by him, especially since he can't be summoned. He also has an ALWAYS_HIT flag so that he will never miss if he gets a melee chance on you....which would really be your own damn fault.
LOSE_INT is there so if he hits you, the dialog would go:
"Death hits you."
"You die."
"You feel very stupid."

N:545: Death
G:W: D
I:100:100d100:100:140:0
W:26:5:0:83000
B:HIT:LOSE_INT:99d99
B:TOUCH:LOSE_INT:99d99
F:UNIQUE | MALE |
F:FORCE_SLEEP | FORCE_MAXHP | ALWAYS_HIT |
F:ESCORT | ESCORTS | SMART |
F:ONLY_ITEM | DROP_2D2 | DROP_3D2 | DROP_4D2 | DROP_GOOD | DROP_GREAT |
F:OPEN_DOOR | BASH_DOOR | POWERFUL | MOVE_BODY |
F:EVIL | UNDEAD | RESPAWN | PASS_WALL | INVISIBLE |
F:IM_FIRE | IM_ELEC | NO_CONF | NO_SLEEP | NO_SUMMON | MUTODORI | NO_DUST |
S:1_IN_2 |
S:HOLD | BLIND | CONF | SCARE | SLOW | CAUSE_4
S:S_SPIDER | S_WRAITH | DRAIN_METER | DRAIN_MANA | TELE_TO |
O:Maintainer feeling evil
D:The bane of all creatures since the beginning of time, Death is an evil
D: nihilist and should be avoided at all costs. Death smiteth with powerful
D: blows and all fear the touch of Death. He may even be lurking just around
D: the corner...

[HailEris]

I think its tempting to blame YASD on bad design ( I know I have before), but I dont think the writer of this thread has much of a leg to stand on i mean, if he got one-hitted by a yeek or a kobold or something sure, but come on it was the freaking lernaean hydra (which is even deadly poisonous in the myth , so its not even like an inside joke or something only a vet would catch) . Complaining about it seems about as silly as decking a grizzly IRL and then bitching @ god when you get mauled .

[Zappa]

I've died a lot and only won once.

One death in particular I give a lot of credit for my win: Kavlax.

I was running around with Bard dropping 'D's like they're Snagas and I see a unique 'd' so I think Bard will tear through this one too.

It breathes, you die.

That was the last time that happened.

[Max Stats]

This reminds my of one monster I made on purpose to indicate that instadeath was definitely a possibility in Animeband. Perhaps a variation of this unique should be put into V? Death has -10 to speed, so you really have no excuse for getting killed by him, especially since he can't be summoned. He also has an ALWAYS_HIT flag so that he will never miss if he gets a melee chance on you....which would really be your own damn fault.

Seems to be along the same line of the Death Mold in V.

[Timo Pietilä]

Seems to be along the same line of the Death Mold in V.

Silver jelly?

[rdermyer]

I was running around with Bard dropping 'D's like they're Snagas and I see a unique 'd' so I think Bard will tear through this one too.

It breathes, you die.

I've done the ol' "Kavlax is only a lowercase d, how hard could he be?" thing before...

[Timo Pietilä]

I've done the ol' "Kavlax is only a lowercase d, how hard could he be?" thing before...

I think pretty much everyone has. Thing is that it might be deadly only at your 50th time you meet it, so it can be surprise even for relatively experienced player.

If it chooses to breathe gravity as its first move you are in trouble. If it chooses to do any other action you are safe.

One of the most interesting monsters in the game, and as such one of the best designed as well. That's a bit like AMHD in Moria, but not quite as deadly.

[Magnate]

I think pretty much everyone has. Thing is that it might be deadly only at your 50th time you meet it, so it can be surprise even for relatively experienced player.

If it chooses to breathe gravity as its first move you are in trouble. If it chooses to do any other action you are safe.

One of the most interesting monsters in the game, and as such one of the best designed as well. That's a bit like AMHD in Moria, but not quite as deadly.

One of my favourites is Gorlim. I don't know whether I just meet him too early, or I keep forgetting how deadly water bolts are, but he's killed several of my characters, and he doesn't seem to get easier with experience. He's one of the reasons I like purple uniques, 'cos I keep thinking he's a ranger or archer or something.

[Timo Pietilä]

One of my favourites is Gorlim. I don't know whether I just meet him too early, or I keep forgetting how deadly water bolts are, but he's killed several of my characters, and he doesn't seem to get easier with experience.

I too have that same problem. Something in Gorlim makes him look less dangerous than he is, which is why I also almost every game try to kill it too soon. Usually I don't die, but it happens every now and then.

[Estie]

Kavlax, Gorlim, Azriel, ArPharazon, Fundin Bluecloak are all delayed till the endgame. I cant remember any stories surrounding them, its been too long ago, but I have this mental note saying "dont touch" and that must be for a reason.

[Hariolor]

Kavlax, Gorlim, Azriel, ArPharazon, Fundin Bluecloak are all delayed till the endgame. I cant remember any stories surrounding them, its been too long ago, but I have this mental note saying "dont touch" and that must be for a reason.

+1

All of them show up relatively early, and each have some combination of fast movement, summoning, and hard-hitting spells/breath. I'd agree that this makes them some of the most interesting enemies as well. Most games I find myself spending a good amount of time and/or resources avoiding them and their summons. Makes for a nice change of pace, and sometimes some fun close calls (sometimes some tragic ones as well).

I'd add Lorgan to this mix, though he can be dispatched a bit earlier on usually.

[dos350]

Kavlax, Gorlim, Azriel, ArPharazon, Fundin Bluecloak are all delayed till the endgame. I cant remember any stories surrounding them, its been too long ago, but I have this mental note saying "dont touch" and that must be for a reason.

eek~ gorlim is a killer of me, so is kevlax~ eek.. i dont get kevlax~ a few chars i just raged him... i think i won the first time but ive lost 2 nice chars to him since then... i avoided azriel on the char i saw hm on.. and gorlim is also a killer of me LOL ... i dont know about arpharazon or fundin!

wat about EOL the dark elf!?`! he has slaughtered one of my good chars!?~

[Magnate]

eek~ gorlim is a killer of me, so is kevlax~ eek.. i dont get kevlax~ a few chars i just raged him... i think i won the first time but ive lost 2 nice chars to him since then... i avoided azriel on the char i saw hm on.. and gorlim is also a killer of me LOL ... i dont know about arpharazon or fundin!

wat about EOL the dark elf!?`! he has slaughtered one of my good chars!?~

Eol and Ar-Pharazon are both JLE additions IIRC, so I don't have as much experience with them, but they could well belong in this category. Kavlax, Gorlim and Azriel are I think the top three in terms of deadliness for their depth. Fundin slightly less so simply because he is quite a lot deeper I think. Cat Lord is also very dangerous but a shade less so than the big three IMO.