Paladin idea for V

[Antoine]

Paladins should receive a small penalty for attacking sleeping monsters or killing non-evil monsters.

I am thinking something like:
- XP award from non-evil monsters is reducd by 10%
- lose 5% of your SP (rounded up) if you hit a sleeping monster. (Not cumulative withina single turn.)

A.

[Derakon]

You cruelly strike the helpless, sleeping Morgoth, Lord of Darkness! The gods are angered with your dishonorable conduct!

This is definitely variant fodder, in my opinion. Vanilla classes aren't about roleplaying or enforcing conducts; they're about providing varied gameplay options. If I want to play a melee mage, or an evil paladin, why shouldn't I be able to?

[Antoine]

You cruelly strike the helpless, sleeping Morgoth, Lord of Darkness! The gods are angered with your dishonorable conduct!

This is definitely variant fodder, in my opinion. Vanilla classes aren't about roleplaying or enforcing conducts; they're about providing varied gameplay options. If I want to play a melee mage, or an evil paladin, why shouldn't I be able to?

Well if it was OK then Beren would have done it

You're probably right about the variant thing, though.

A.

[Atarlost]

Beren was less suicidal than an Angband character.

[fyonn]

I always thought that one should get some kind of hit bonus/damage multiplier (x2, x3?) for hitting a sleeping target. I mean, how much of a defence are they putting up when you can place your sword in just the right place, and then shove...

it would give a real bonus to having high stealth, esp for earlier and weaker characters.

dave

[SaThaRiel]

I always thought that one should get some kind of hit bonus/damage multiplier (x2, x3?) for hitting a sleeping target. I mean, how much of a defence are they putting up when you can place your sword in just the right place, and then shove...

it would give a real bonus to having high stealth, esp for earlier and weaker characters.

dave

Actually i was thinking of this as a bonus for rogues. I think in Zangband you cruely stab sleeping creatures as a rogue.
But basically you are right - it may fit for every class. Well, maybe the honorable warrior wakes his potential target before slashing it with his broad sword

[Antoine]

I always thought that one should get some kind of hit bonus/damage multiplier (x2, x3?) for hitting a sleeping target. I mean, how much of a defence are they putting up when you can place your sword in just the right place, and then shove...

it would give a real bonus to having high stealth, esp for earlier and weaker characters.

dave

Ironband has this, and probably so do other variants

A.

[fyonn]

Actually i was thinking of this as a bonus for rogues. I think in Zangband you cruely stab sleeping creatures as a rogue.
But basically you are right - it may fit for every class. Well, maybe the honorable warrior wakes his potential target before slashing it with his broad sword

who said honourable?

hehehe.. finally a use for those sleep monster wands... sleep, hit, sleep hit, teehee...[1]

dave

[1] and I don't think I'd consider that an abuse either... finally give some use to the damn things

[SaThaRiel]

Oh, btw...i would also consider reducing the monsters AC instead of increasing the chars AT. Normally you dont attack "better" but the enemy defends worse in such scenarios - not that i ever tried it in real life
It may give a real push to all "sneaking" classes/races. Not sure if it wont make them too strong.

[fyonn]

Oh, btw...i would also consider reducing the monsters AC instead of increasing the chars AT. Normally you dont attack "better" but the enemy defends worse in such scenarios - not that i ever tried it in real life
It may give a real push to all "sneaking" classes/races. Not sure if it wont make them too strong.

I see what you mean, but if you came across a sleeping orc, one could imagine delicately putting the tip of a dagger/sword right under the ribs, pointing towards the heart and then shoving hard[1], as opposed to hacking and slashing away at his armour. ie I can see the justification for a damage multiplier for example..

dave

[1] or a finely judged whack on the head from a mace of course...

[Derakon]

You could just increase the crit chance against sleeping targets. That seems more elegant to me than having a special-purpose damage multiplier.

[fyonn]

You could just increase the crit chance against sleeping targets. That seems more elegant to me than having a special-purpose damage multiplier.

sounds reasonable.. though I can't remember how the crit system works. I think that a "to hit" bonus would be warranted too mind.

David