Too much junk or too many monsters?

[Donald Jonker]

After playing a little Ironband, and seeing the monster rebalancing there (or maybe it's just in the early stages)... it strikes me that one angle that hasn't been thoroughly considered in the TMJ problem is the possibility that there are just too many damn monsters. I think that 3.1's philosophy of fewer, better drops may be actually misdirected, not on account of the items, but on account of who's doing the dropping.

The only real reason to take on massive quantities of enemies, orc and troll pits, for instance, is for the mass quantity of drops; except for that cusp instance where they bump you up a level or two, when they become feasible for clearing, they're no longer a danger, and no longer fun. Nevertheless, you keep seeing them all the way down to Morgoth: why? The most interesting combat scenarios are with at most 2-3 powerful enemies, never weaker, never more. The game ought to acknowledge this fact and refactor accordingly.

It seems to me if we shifted the balance of item collection to the floor, it could be much more easily balanced, and then monsters could be generated in depth to better reflect the difficulty you want to maintain throughout the game. I suppose for flavor's sake we want to see the occasional out of depth unique, but I don't see the need for regular infusions of shallow monsters deep in the dungeon whose only purpose is item harvest.

If items are mostly found on the floor, then you remove a powerful incentive to kill monsters: it would have to be either for xp or for fun. I think the separation could be productive in making combat interactions more than just a game of pinata.

[Zikke]

My favorite part in the lifecycle of a character is the part in the game when I have a really solid set of gear, am ready to start fighting Sauron, but I scum around 98 looking for all of the native uniques. Each fight has its own nuances and they are challenging but it's not a clusterf*ck of low level trash.

I would love an option in V to dramatically reduce the amount of trash but increase these types of 1v1 1vFew fights with much harder targets. The loot from those targets can be much bigger to compensate.

[rdanhenry]

Reducing out-of-depth monsters can be a good thing in moderation. Previous versions of Steamband suffered buggy behavior from overly restricted monster and item generation.

When autoscum came in, it allowed people to make "interesting" levels routine. This made them cease to be particularly interesting. Pits and vaults sprung up everywhere. I think they should be generated sparsely enough to create excitement when encountered. However, armies of orcs and trolls are so thematically appropriate, I certainly wouldn't want to see those pits removed. Dealing with large numbers can be a challenge in itself, too, or reproducing monsters would not have a point.

[TJS]

Perhaps drops could be split into two types with one more common than the other. So you could have consumables and the spell books from town in the common group, and weapons, equipment and stat potions in the uncommon group.

The quality of equipment drops could be increased since you have them happening less often and also it makes playing without ?WoR easier since there are more consumables about.

[Mondkalb]

Perhaps drops could be split into two types with one more common than the other. So you could have consumables and the spell books from town in the common group, and weapons, equipment and stat potions in the uncommon group.

The quality of equipment drops could be increased since you have them happening less often and also it makes playing without ?WoR easier since there are more consumables about.

/ Signed.
I just thought about that last night.