Removal suggestions

[Shockbolt]

Removal suggestion 1: Angels

I never quite got the link between Angband and Angels ingame, perhaps it would be wise to drop those religious creatures out of the game, in order to creep closer to the "middle-earth feel"?

I know some of you will say: if we drop those then we need to drop these and those also. But right now, I can only think of those with a religious link within the game, everything else that is non-angband is either brought in from myths or the like.

[Timo Pietilä]

Removal suggestion 1: Angels

I never quite got the link between Angband and Angels ingame, perhaps it would be wise to drop those religious creatures out of the game, in order to creep closer to the "middle-earth feel"?

I know some of you will say: if we drop those then we need to drop these and those also. But right now, I can only think of those with a religious link within the game, everything else that is non-angband is either brought in from myths or the like.

No more than angels. Angels are just part of one of main religious beliefs, just like titans were in their time. Both mythical creatures from religious fairy tales.

OTOH your point them not being Tolkenian monsters is a valid one, and many variants have replaced them with Ainur. I would have nothing against changing angels to ainur.

[Shockbolt]

Yeah, replacing them would work better than a pure removal I guess.

No more than angels. Angels are just part of one of main religious beliefs, just like titans were in their time. Both mythical creatures from religious fairy tales.

OTOH your point them not being Tolkenian monsters is a valid one, and many variants have replaced them with Ainur. I would have nothing against changing angels to ainur.

[fizzix]

Yeah, replacing them would work better than a pure removal I guess.

I agree with that, if mainly because the angels are interesting monsters. Resist all brands/slays, high ac, deeply asleep (except for the uniques), and they also have interesting attacks including tele-to and tele-away, depending on the angel.

Gabriel and Azriel are also very interesting. Azriel, is the 2nd most likely cause of death for me, right behind drolem. Uriel is just another fire based unique, like Lernean hydra, phoenix, vargo, gothmog, and lungorthin. He's the least interesting angel by far. So I would greatly oppose removing the angels. However, I don't care at all if they're renamed.

[Shockbolt]

Who would have the powers/authority to decide to permanently rename the various angelic creatures in Angband, into something more inline with Tolkien?

[JohnCW9]

No more than angels. Angels are just part of one of main religious beliefs, just like titans were in their time. Both mythical creatures from religious fairy tales.

OTOH your point them not being Tolkenian monsters is a valid one, and many variants have replaced them with Ainur. I would have nothing against changing angels to ainur.

You both are totally wrong They are just as real as you are and I have had dealings with angels.

[Shockbolt]

Ok then, outside of this game, we agree to disagree regarding angels. Let's keep the discussion within Angband.

You both are totally wrong They are just as real as you are and I have had dealings with angels.

[Netbrian]

I've become fond of the angels, and vote to keep them as they are. Angband isn't as much Tolkein as a strange mash-up between D&D, Tolkein, and whatever else we felt like putting in -- I don't think they damage thematic consistency worse than anything else, and I like how they present a unique challenge.

[Timo Pietilä]

Who would have the powers/authority to decide to permanently rename the various angelic creatures in Angband, into something more inline with Tolkien?

That would be Takkaria. He is the maintainer, so his word is decisive one over everybody else.

While angband is currently developed by a team, he is (or at least should be) the one with the power to make decisions.

[JohnCW9]

Ok then, outside of this game, we agree to disagree regarding angels. Let's keep the discussion within Angband.

Ok I agree wtih that.

[relic]

When I first started playing Angband, I was surprised to find that there were angels among the creatures. They seemed to me to be very out of place. I would be glad to have them renamed (to Ainur or something else) or even replaced by something totally new.

[Magnate]

That would be Takkaria. He is the maintainer, so his word is decisive one over everybody else.

While angband is currently developed by a team, he is (or at least should be) the one with the power to make decisions.

Correct. Takkaria is currently on vacation, but we can ask for a decision afterwards. The best way to do this is for somebody to put a new version of monster.txt on github and submit a "pull request" titled "New names for angels", or similar. Then any of the devteam can simply say "takkaria: ok for me to merge pull request #xyz?", with a link to the details of the proposed changes.

In case anyone is interested, this is the best way to get anything changed in the game.

[takkaria]

When I first started playing Angband, I was surprised to find that there were angels among the creatures. They seemed to me to be very out of place. I would be glad to have them renamed (to Ainur or something else) or even replaced by something totally new.

I'd be pretty happy with seeing them renamed, they seem pretty out of place in the game.

[Shockbolt]

Yay! Just provide me with a list of the new replacements when they are ready and I'll be happy to paint them. Also, I guess now is the time to rename any other inappropriate creatures, so I can paint new tiles for those as well.

I'd be pretty happy with seeing them renamed, they seem pretty out of place in the game.

[Antoine]

I'd be pretty happy with seeing them renamed, they seem pretty out of place in the game.

What about making them slaadi?

Slaads are authentic D&D source material, powerful extra-planar summoners with a variety of powers, non-evil but dangerous, with a few unique leaders, at least one of which uses death powers and at least one of which uses fire powers

pretty close match really

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slaad

A.